Negative concerns about the 501st legion?

[Imperial_juggernaut[501st]]

    Hello white armor.net, TK 74182. I have a question, i was looking at other countries 501st events one day and i notice people on the web were having concerns about us being too strict or us being a negative role model to others since we dress up as villains or resemble real world militaries, how should we address this issue? thank you.

[FN1313[TK]]

https://www.501st.com/mission.php

I say the mission says exactly what is necessary.


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[justjoseph63[Staff]]

Those posting the negative comments online obviously have no idea what we represent.  If they would bother to dig a little deeper into our organization, they would find that we have raised over $360,000.00 for the "Make-A-Wish" foundation and many, many thousands more for local charities.

We spend crazy amounts of money building our costume(s) and then drive countless miles to appear (for free) at the events we attend on our own time.

 

Remember, we only show up when we are invited, and this includes children's hospitals, police community events, parades, etc.   We are asked back to these events year after year for a reason.  Yes, we are the "bad guys", but what kid wouldn't want to meet a "real life" Stormtrooper who gives them a high-five?

 

We don't do this for notoriety.  We do it because we care.  Yeah, it's fun to dress up as your favorite SW character, but when you see a giant ear-to-ear smile on a kid (or adult) at a troop it makes all the time (and money) you spent building that costume worthwhile.

 

"Bad guys doing good".

 

Side note:  I have been on more troops than I can count, and I have noticed that the vast majority of those wanting photos with members of the 501st (especially TKs) FAR outweighs those wanting a pic with a Jedi.  No offense to you Rebel Legion types, lol.

[FN1313[TK]]

The other reality is most who say such negative things are those who don’t want to put effort into replica costumes or sadly those who were disfellowshipped from 501st due to any number of reasons. I generally don’t see much in terms of negativity from most people.

Even as a GML when I work with individuals who don’t have approvable costumes or think I’m strict once I explain the details and the quality differences I’d say most understand and then find themselves asking how to get to that point rather than getting offended.


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[gmrhodes13[Staff]]

A lot comes from our costuming standards, some not understanding and frustrated they haven't been approved so the first thing to do is yell out on social media the legion is too strict. That's not to diminish some peoples experience in the legion a lot can be negative but I find the positive more out ways the negative.

 

 Every club has it's issues, look at our former LCO takes to social media and rants over issues she encounered, that's not the way a club leader should act.

 

Social media is the easiest way to get negativity out there in the world, it has a lot to answer for.

 

Mostly my time in the legion has been positive, hopefully that remains until I call it a day.

[BAZINGA[TK]]

I can tell you from personal experience that it just takes one person (and in my case it was a 501st TK) to throw water on someone's hopes.  Thankfully a lot has changed since then.  I vowed that should I ever get to the 501st that I would never be "that guy" who dashes someone's hope.   After that, for a short while, I had nothing good to say about the 501st.  It was an elitist group that forgot what they were supposed to represent and were taking themselves far too seriously for walking around in plastic armor.

 

My point is, not everyone is good at PR and should a 501st member be that someone it is better to defer to the member who is good at it.  I spent many hours at the club table during my first troop talking to lots of people and no one was anything but excited about the 501st.  Everyone got the idea of the bad guys doing good and were excited about it.

 

When the day comes that a Karen or Ken is going to try and give us grief I'm prepared with the facts.  You might not change their mind with those facts but you can deliver them and move on to the person who does want to see you there.  I see no point in whipping a dead horse if their mind can't be changed or they just want to make trouble.

 

Bart

 

And, there is still nothing cooler than seeing lots of the shinny white armor together in a group.  That is just plain cool and will never grow old.

Edited May 24, 2023 by BAZINGA

[Sly11[Admin]]

I think most of what I have to say has already bee posted above.

 

There can be bad eggs in any group that don't necessarily portray the ideal roll model for a club, and we are not free or exempt from that.

There are more good eggs in the 501st carton than bad that is for sure, but there are many many elements and opinions  that can occur to have some one say you are all bad because of x or y or z.

 

Something we do here on FISD is take pride in making sure our forum community is supported, we have a friendly environment and give plenty of reason for people to come visit us here and see what we do and how we assist in making dreams come true and changing peoples lives.

We don't tolerate bulling, we don't allow politics as a general topic or anything really that can divide our members, we focus on uniting our massive family in a positive way and this is part of the reason why we have the most active forums in the legion.

 

It's not just what people experience out on the street, it is what they experience on all avenues, like our social media platforms etc, and that is why we also don't tolerate the above mention things anywhere.

We are the same where ever you visit FISD and can only hope those who are our members do the same when out on a troop or meeting the public face to face.

[Imperial_juggernaut[501st]]

19 hours ago, FN1313 said:

https://www.501st.com/mission.php

I say the mission says exactly what is necessary.


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thank you everyone

[FN1313[TK]]

One final note I’ll say. Being a GML I’ve had to deal with the potential of lots of negative response when a costume doesn’t meet basic approval standards. It really sucks and honestly many times I wonder why I still do it.

That being said almost every time I get initial negativity in responses as soon as I’ve better explained the replica standard and help offered through forum and garrison resources most people tend to have an instant change of anger and despair to hope (who says stormtroopers aren’t better Jedi than the Jedi themselves?)

Even today I had just that. Someone submitted armor that was commercially bought from a well know bad and unapprovable source and I had provided a very detailed comparison and explanation of the mods.

Their initial response was quite negative but I continued to help them see the future perspective and understand that many of us have been there before. Myself included. My first approved tk was not my first tk submission. Rubies taught me a lot about quality of replicas lol.

The individual though bummed truly seemed to be interested in finding and getting resources after knowing they were not alone and there are still ways to get there and be involved.


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[gmrhodes13[Staff]]

^^THIS^^

 

Very common with GML's to encounter negative interactions, there's always some joker that flies off the handle, the really bad ones I post their costume photos in the GML sections of the main 501st forum, they are then judged by detachment staff, they don't seem to complain as much when it comes from detachment staff and it's too bad for them if more things are noticed  

 

[Coolajxl[TK]]

So being relatively new to the 501st, I though I'd share my thoughts. I first remember meeting the 501st at a Charlotte Checkers Game in 2014. Here's some picture of little me at that event:

Finding out about them, I always thought it was super cool what the group does with it's charity and community work. However, it was defiantly intimidating to join. It seemed like something that was a "nice thought" but never something I'd be able to do. I was worried that my level of costuming wouldn't meet the standards (tbh I still worry about that). But with the resources on the different forums and the helpful people that are able to provide input, I was fortunate enough to figure out how to get in!

 

Now that I'm in, it has opened my eyes to both the good and the bad behind the curtains. Majority has been good. I've meet some very nice and helpful people at my garrison. I've seen first hand what good my actions have on people and what joy it can bring them.

Only bad is the legion politics and hearing about random drama happening. But that's bound to happen with like what, 15,000 people worldwide? It is a little bummer to hear when that stuff happens, but it's not a deal breaker for me. Like I said, there is majority good happening.

I'm excited to continue being apart of this group for years to come!

[BAZINGA[TK]]

1 hour ago, Coolajxl said:

t was defiantly intimidating to join. It seemed like something that was a "nice thought" but never something I'd be able to do.

 

^^ this ^^

 

That is a hurtle to get over for sure.  How can it not be for most?  I mean you are going to have to meet a standard and are going to be held to a standard whenever trooping.  That's a lot at the beginning and finding the right members to coach you along is one way through that.

 

Bart

[Coolajxl[TK]]

6 hours ago, BAZINGA said:

 

^^ this ^^

 

That is a hurtle to get over for sure.  How can it not be for most?  I mean you are going to have to meet a standard and are going to be held to a standard whenever trooping.  That's a lot at the beginning and finding the right members to coach you along is one way through that.

 

Bart

 

Exactly! That's what's been intimidating for me to work more on my TK Kit. I feel there's a lot of pressure to make any cut or glue as it isn't able to be undone. When I got it I laid everything out and got super overwhelmed. I did however get the motivation yesterday to finish the assembly/glue together a bicep piece! So yay! Small victory! It was also a used kit so it's partially assembled already so I had to figure out where in the proccess it is to being completed.

Luckily I have two things going for me that can help. 1) The forums here have a LOT of information. I used that one extensive Anovos assembly guide to help with the bicep yesterday. 2) I have someone from my garrison coming this coming Saturday to help get me started and guide me on what to do!

[Coolajxl[TK]]

8 hours ago, Coolajxl said:

 

Exactly! That's what's been intimidating for me to work more on my TK Kit. I feel there's a lot of pressure to make any cut or glue as it isn't able to be undone.

I should clarify, I mean more my own personal pressure to get it right and follow the guidelines. Sorry for any confusion

[Abdel[501st]]

There's been alot of amazing replies to this. And I'm sure there are interactions that didn't go in the best way. It happens. We aren't perfect. And to those people they may not appreciate us, or talk bad about us for that one experience. All we can really do, is try our best to always do what we can to show a shining beacon of goodness and continue to do the good works that we do do. We will never please everyone. No matter how hard we try. Just keep trying to better ourselves. So we can better everyone else!! 

[Coolajxl[TK]]

50 minutes ago, Abdel said:

There's been alot of amazing replies to this. And I'm sure there are interactions that didn't go in the best way. It happens. We aren't perfect. And to those people they may not appreciate us, or talk bad about us for that one experience. All we can really do, is try our best to always do what we can to show a shining beacon of goodness and continue to do the good works that we do do. We will never please everyone. No matter how hard we try. Just keep trying to better ourselves. So we can better everyone else!! 

Well said!

[BAZINGA[TK]]

1 hour ago, Abdel said:

There's been alot of amazing replies to this. And I'm sure there are interactions that didn't go in the best way. It happens. We aren't perfect. And to those people they may not appreciate us, or talk bad about us for that one experience. All we can really do, is try our best to always do what we can to show a shining beacon of goodness and continue to do the good works that we do do. We will never please everyone. No matter how hard we try. Just keep trying to better ourselves. So we can better everyone else!! 

 

Now I am getting all those positive feelings again.   Bart

[Jayse01]

So Im going to put this out there. as much as it is an awesome group. Who do amazing things to help those in the community. There is always that very small percentage that is negative. 

I have chosen to ignore that and get on with what Im doing, that is kitting up as the action figure and making kids and adults smile. 

I give up my time, that maybe a small amount of time or a couple of days for some events. To raise money. But with that, there is a negative. Might be a small comment like "suck your guts in" (just recently). Now I know I have a bit of a stomach. But that has a lasting effect. And when it comes from a fellow member, hurts that bit more. 

But I keep doing what I do, because I love it. Im me and you accept it or you dont. But expect that at one time that person may blow up from that comment. Like any normal person. At the end of the day that is what we all are, just normal people. Doing a bit more to help others. 

As for difficult people submitting for approval. That is out of frustration, also could be because of the negative comments that had been made to them. Goes both ways. But people need to be educated. and those who have been around long enough maybe should help new recruits with the kit they want to get approved. Or maybe inform them they could ask someone who can help them out. We all want to move the Legion forward with more recruits, maybe a little help would go along way to getting them onboard. 

[wdhjr87]

There have been a lot of good responses here, but I wanted to be sure to represent an important opinion about how difficult it is to actually join the 501st. While I totally understand the need for high standards and want to help to uphold them, it is incredibly difficult to get started down the journey of actually joining, especially if you don't have an active garrison located nearby. I have had teeth pulled before. The process and availability of any help to try to join the 501st Legion is literally worse than having teeth pulled. I have been trying to get help for six months, and I inevitably end up hitting a wall. My local garrison has canceled any events where prospective members could learn more about the group. Elsewhere online, people are reluctant to give any actual advice and will not name vendors that are reputable sources for costume pieces. I have wasted hundreds of dollars on worthless items because I was not able to actually talk to someone who knew what they were talking about. And by the time I submitted anything, the money and time were wasted.

I'll ask plainly: how can someone hope to join this organization, which requires having a completed costume, if they have no idea how to complete a costume, and it's against the rules to help anyone who isn't a member? It seems completely unsustainable, and I completely understand the frustrations of people who feel similarly after facing these kinds of experiences. 

[gmrhodes13[Staff]]

2 hours ago, wdhjr87 said:

There have been a lot of good responses here, but I wanted to be sure to represent an important opinion about how difficult it is to actually join the 501st. While I totally understand the need for high standards and want to help to uphold them, it is incredibly difficult to get started down the journey of actually joining, especially if you don't have an active garrison located nearby. I have had teeth pulled before. The process and availability of any help to try to join the 501st Legion is literally worse than having teeth pulled. I have been trying to get help for six months, and I inevitably end up hitting a wall. My local garrison has canceled any events where prospective members could learn more about the group. Elsewhere online, people are reluctant to give any actual advice and will not name vendors that are reputable sources for costume pieces. I have wasted hundreds of dollars on worthless items because I was not able to actually talk to someone who knew what they were talking about. And by the time I submitted anything, the money and time were wasted.

I'll ask plainly: how can someone hope to join this organization, which requires having a completed costume, if they have no idea how to complete a costume, and it's against the rules to help anyone who isn't a member? It seems completely unsustainable, and I completely understand the frustrations of people who feel similarly after facing these kinds of experiences. 

I'm sorry to hear you have had a negative experience, I see you only have one post on the forum so not sure if you have researched here before, this thread is pretty well full of everything you would need to know:

If you have found the 501st legion website you can also find info on costumes, they are housed under different detachments, FISD being for Stormtroopers, once you are here most introduce themselves and are normally given info to help them on the way.

 

I actually researched, purchased armor, built it, got 501st approved all without even seeing a local member, it took me 2 weeks to complete, I had been waiting 6 months for it to arrive so had plenty of time to get research done in regards to building, tools needed and soft parts, all the info is here on the forum as well as lots of galleries full of images, shortly after I also obtained Level 2 and L3 approvals. 

 

We can't openly speak about amror makers, the info is not forward facing as that is our deal with Lucasfilm/Disney we do not promote or recommend where to purchase armor although we do however have a "vetted sellers list" in the Getting Started area. These makers we know there has not been any negative interactions and all supply quality kits.

 

Research is the key to this hobby, it's not cheap, you do need some basic tool skills. Don't be afraid to ask questions, there are no silly questions, only silly mistakes from not asking, and measure twice and cut once. 

 

Research, research, research, you can never do enough  

[Sly11[Admin]]

Hi Will,

 

We are here to support you as much as possible.

As Glen mentioned above, we specifically look after Stormtroopers, but that does not mean we won't help you if you desire a different costume.

We have thousands of members who have built other costumes, this includes many of the command staff.

We also have a section called Other areas of interest, where members post about what they are working on or have completed from other Detachments and outside the Star Wars universe.

 

Let us know what costume you desire, and we will give assistance and also put you in contact with the right people to get you on your journey.

[T-Jay[TK]]

10 hours ago, wdhjr87 said:

There have been a lot of good responses here, but I wanted to be sure to represent an important opinion about how difficult it is to actually join the 501st. While I totally understand the need for high standards and want to help to uphold them, it is incredibly difficult to get started down the journey of actually joining, especially if you don't have an active garrison located nearby. I have had teeth pulled before. The process and availability of any help to try to join the 501st Legion is literally worse than having teeth pulled. I have been trying to get help for six months, and I inevitably end up hitting a wall. My local garrison has canceled any events where prospective members could learn more about the group. Elsewhere online, people are reluctant to give any actual advice and will not name vendors that are reputable sources for costume pieces. I have wasted hundreds of dollars on worthless items because I was not able to actually talk to someone who knew what they were talking about. And by the time I submitted anything, the money and time were wasted.

I'll ask plainly: how can someone hope to join this organization, which requires having a completed costume, if they have no idea how to complete a costume, and it's against the rules to help anyone who isn't a member? It seems completely unsustainable, and I completely understand the frustrations of people who feel similarly after facing these kinds of experiences. 

I completely understand your frustration but with your registration here on FISD and your posting above you have taken your first step into a larger world.
As Andrew already wrote, tell us your favorite character and we help you here or point you in the right direction. 

[wdhjr87]

Thank you for the responses and encouragement. I basically spent a long time trying to do this myself because I wasn’t getting any responses from my local garrison, and when I submitted for approval, the response I got back said there was no hope to get approved and that I should instead join with a TIE Reservist jumpsuit or something, which I had no interest in. Since I wasted so much money on something I can’t even resell or use, it was discouraging. 
 

While I think I’d ultimately like to have a classic Stormtrooper armor costume, I realize it might be easier to join with a simpler costume first, and I’ve been looking at options of officer uniforms. I have joined the IOC detachment forum and have been looking for help there. Unfortunately, their mentor or advisor program seems to have died, and it currently amounts to one person offering to help in DMs — not unhelpful but not the kind of program I was looking for. 
 

I also think it’s worth pointing out that it has been incredibly difficult to engage with my garrison, which seems to be large inactive or else active somewhere that I’m not able to be yet. And while I understand the benefit of forums for archiving information and housing long threads, it hasn’t been as helpful for real-time engagement or actually finding people who can help directly. I have tried to find Discord servers or local events but have not had much luck and have in fact only encountered a lot of resistance. 

[Shanester[TK]]

I purchased and built my Stormtrooper with no local help at all.  I got good advise here and did my research.  I have trooped over 80 times with that armor and I plan to do 80 more (at least).  At the same time, I help folks who are not Legion members, all the time. There is no rule against it and if there were, I would be a repeat offender.  Nobody says its easy, but you will be glad you put in there work.

[Morgi[Staff]]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb wdhjr87:

I have tried to find Discord servers or local events but have not had much luck and have in fact only encountered a lot of resistance. 

 

It's your lucky day! We've got a Discord server for FISD -- you can find all the info regarding it over here! Feel free to join!

 

Regarding the lack of help: my Stormtrooper was my first ever costume and I built it without any in person help -- the people on this forum helped me tremendously by giving feedback and encouraging me. You can certainly build your own Stormtrooper, even without prior experience, and you don't have to have in person help, as nice as that might be. 

 

Looking forward to having you join the ranks soon!