Daetrin

As long as it's a sticky - we might as well say that an out of the box Rubies Stormtrooper is not 501st acceptable. We (FISD) believe with the right modifications and a helmet swap it should be able to pass muster.

I took a tape measure to compare old FX and TE2 thighs, and FX, RT, and TE2 shins. Funny enough the overall dimensions of lengths are very similar, but the real difference is in the shape of the cuts, which had a big impact on how they look.

One last item: while it's all well and good for FISD to have an Elite (or whatever) program and develop and own those standards, it is *never* our place to tell people how to troop. If the GML of UKG wants to wear a canvas belt, I'll proudly troop next to him and keep is post-trooping pint full.

1. Well the proof is in the pudding. What evidence we have is what we see on screen. Sometimes what we hear supports it, as using boy scout pack frames for sandtroopers. Also too we're not trying to codify one-offs. Even if one TK was walking around with a leather belt, that doesn't change our standard just like some TK's having no ammo counter on their E-11's or gaffers tape for hand plates, or missing tube stripes. These are minor inconsistencies of the prop/wardrobe departments rather than say the grappling hook + comlink substitution that Luke's armor has, which is a prominent part of the story line and has a lot of good reference shots. 2. No, having one and trooping with another does not defeat the purpose. Elite or MEPD is a recognition of costume achievement and an incentive for people to take their costumes to a higher level of accuracy than what the 501st policy calls for. To me it doesn't make sense to get an extra leather belt to troop in when one already has a quality canvas one with plastic inserts, however FISD isn't out to dictate how people decide to troop - which is a personal decision, no? What matters is that if we did a roll call at a con they could still show up in 100% conformation (e.g. not get the belt then throw it in the rubbish). 3. No, I did not get your email. I think the other Paul really hits the nail on the head and his logic is sound. Perhaps your friend really does remember wearing a leather belt. Perhaps he's even right. Perhaps he was just standing in the background and we never see it. At this point we can only go by screen caps. Reports of what was found in the LFL archives support what we see on screen but are not used as the sole source of information, just like interviews from 30 years ago confirm the boy scout pack parts. This wasn't a memory recorded recently, but an interview made at the time. Paul

From the evidence I don't see anything that would indicate these are leather. I guess I'm confused on what kind of membership this "costs" us? You don't need to be Elite to be a detachment member. And even for Elite you could just get a canvas belt to get that status and then troop with a leather belt all you want. Just like in MEPD I need all the kit to get deployed, but that doesn't mean I have to troop that way. Heck, you could get Elite here with an AP helmet then stick it on a shelf and troop with an FX. I guess if people felt strongly about it we really should put up a poll to gauge interest.

You may want to try RT or old FX thighs which are sculpted differently is all I can think of. Alas, I'm not an expert with a heat gun

Hi Simon, I can totally understand where you are coming from. MEPD allowed this and it was actually the route I went (thank you TK409!) when I did my TD. As long as there is a screen shot to support the ask, I’d be open to changing the Elite standard. Paul

Elite only really specifies the mounting. Otherwise if it looks right, flies right as they say in the Air Force (e.g. if it's otherwise 501st approved).

All set Luis!

John & Steve - still says no costumes listed. Can either of you bug your GML or the LMO to define what it is? You're both 501st, but I would prefer for consistency to see the TK listed to grant full detachment access.

As has been said the point of Elite (or MEPD Police Officer, etc.) is to capture the common details and to clean up a lot of the most glaring inaccuracies of the base 501st standard, not every little exception nor be 100% screen accurate on all details. I'm not aware of a screen cap with a leather belt. The only reason plastic belts are allowed Legion wide is that plastic belts shipped with FX kits and it's only been the past few years that canvas was identified as the correct material. There are great tutorials on how to make belts with inserts on these boards easily enough, and both Gundamzeppelin & FireBladeJedi sell ones with inserts at very reasonable costs.

All set Chris! Thanks to all for posting links - makes my job faster

Gotcha covered Joe! Let's see some pix and an intro

Kevin so has the right of it. FISD and SpecOps will always be partners and work together. As you've seen from the last two TX related posts, the black hole trooper can be pretty cool in it's own right. They are our brothers in arms, and deserve equal respect.

Just posting a bump to remind us admins to create a sticky for this information. Remember also that this has not yet met with the LMO approval process, so what we offer up are what we believe to be the mods necessary for approval.

No worries - if SpecOps doesn't create an Elite program for Black Hole troopers, I'm more than happy to create one Yessssssss...Elite Black Hole troopers

My o my!! The TX treatment really makes the MRCE come alive. I bet all the FX TX helmets are looking nervously at their owners now - that is one shweeeeeeeeeeeeeet looking lid and I may have to get one...just to have one!

All set Steve. Would love to see pix of your TD sometime. Till then - see ya on MEPD!

Thanks Will - I knew you were 501st but couldn't recall if you were TK and TC, or just TC.

The cod doesn't *have* to be cut. Mine is not and I'm able to do what I need to do. Just loosen the belt, undo the thigh straps, and do your thang.

Tai bang le! It is as the Emperor has foreseen. You will take your place in the front lines brother Even. Congratulations on leading the vanguard of FISD in the Middle Kingdom.

Yes, we're talking 501st standards which are much lower than Elite. Elite should be broken out in to a separate conversation.

Good catch - yes side gaps are permissible for all TK variants on 501st standards.

Yup, that's the crux of it. It's all in the build - a well done FX will always look better than a poorly built TM. Now we know a Rubies with enough attention to detail - plus a helmet swap - can be made to look 501st acceptable. What we should do is catalog the list of changes required and codify it. This is what was done by the UKG with regards to the MRCE helmet and as we've seen was rapidly adopted by MEPD & FISD, and then Legion wide. It's due to that discrete list of codified changes that IMHO allowed the MRCE to become so amazingly popular. So, are we saying that the required changes would be: 1. Replace the helmet with a 501st approved option 2. Replace the oversized bodysuit with one that is 501st acceptable. 3. Large gaps on side of armour to be corrected (if present) 4. A 501st acceptable holster needs to be acquired and mounted. 5. Armor has to be properly trimmed/shimmed/adjusted to the wearer, just like all other armor makes. * * This is required of all applicants, regardless of armor make

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