Daetrin

Nice! Great to see you taking the TK plunge Jim. Please do say you'll go at least EI (if not Centurion) as it's terrible that we only have two other EI troopers in Garrison Titan other than myself I could use a little trim if you have any extra...

Wow. That's all I can say. Great job!

OK guys, I think we have enough on the public Q&A that we've nailed this down pretty good. In preparate for voting which will start next week, I've created a Det-Only Q&A at http://forum.whitearmor.net/index.php?showtopic=14854 We will get a bulk email out over the weekend so that our fellow troopers who don't visit the boards much get a reminder and a chance to review as well.

How the requirements are structured is that one is a superset of the other. Just like EI adds on to the 501st standards, Centurion adds on to EI. Every Centurion will thus be both 501st approved and EI. Troopers can opt to go Centurion from the start or build their suit in stages, e.g. start at Crl, then go EI, then go Centurion. Just like how today people can go EI as their 501st submission. This is also the reason why we set it up that Centurion can't conflict with EI.

Two quick things: 1) That paint job is *gorgeous!*. Love the shade of red - this will rock 2) We're in the process of combining standards - I know it's confusing now but we'll have this squared away in the next few weeks.

That's one fantastic build up! We oughta pin this somewhere, or copy it as a HOWTO. A+ job John

I'm 6'00" about 175lbs, 32" waist jeans (with a belt).

I dunno, I'm just not getting it. I think you need to send it to: Paul Hoeffer xxxx xx Ave SE asersad iaadsfsfd, WA asdfs United States Only way I can really see what you're talking about, methinks. j/k - AWESOME! You make me wish I was shorter!

Dennis, I'm going to break out the most open questions for separate vote. I mean, the EI requirements have been built up over years and didn't sprint out fully formed, so I think we can at least start with a base of what the majority agree on and move up from there. My expectation is that just like EI and Police Officer standards, the Centurion will not be static but will have to be revised every few years as accurate props/mods get easier/less expensive and better information becomes available. Hard to believe but the MEPD Police Officer standards of 2005 (when I joined) are pretty much Legion CRL now, and thus the Police Officer standards were significantly upgraded in 2008, and now we have SWAT, etc. Heck, the original EI standards allowed FX helmets, if you'll recall.

OK, updates made. Please review and do let me know if I mssed anything. I'll leave this up for the rest of the week before moving final break-outs to the detachment only area.

Sorry guys - hiking too longer than I'd like and trying to get these helmets in a natural light has not been as possible as I'd like. Still, I got a few before the house got dark - hopefully these will be OK for now until I get get better lighting: ATA #1 TE2 on the left - note the different levels of bumpy caps Tried to get a close-up of Terry's air brushing, but will need a better camera I think There is a wave in the left tube stripe that is present in both - again I'll have to get the better camera I think Terry even did the star foam, but it's a little too think and I can't get it fully down on my noggin' Back of the ATA. Note there is still some good bumps in the ABS pull, though far less severe than the TE2. Alas, this camera/lighting combo is less than ideal. Hopefully we'll get some better light tomorrow.

Anyone want to see a nice comparison between a spanking new ATA ABS (built by PandaTrooper) vs. an TE2 HIPS (built by TK-4510)? I just got the former from the maker yesterday and am completely blown away. Two gorgeous helmets by two reputable makers... (and tides me over until US Customs delivers my TM's )

First of all - this is fantastic! I'm really pleased to see that there is consensus on many issues. @Bluey/Obihahn - thanks for the detailed responses - this is exactly what I was hoping to see Cleaning up much of the language should be straight forward. Here are some issues that seem to come up several times. @Side gaps: The question would be if we allow for a gap, how big is OK before you lose the canonical look of an ANH TK. And, what percentage do we actually see on screen, for how long? @Crotch snaps: I'm thinking we may break this out when voting time comes as it seems to really divide people. @Overlap of biceps: another one that will be broken out for vote or removed entirely. @Boots: Painted black boots seems to be a minority, but most seem good with scuffs, so we'll change that to scuffs for now and see how it goes. If it still causes angst, we'll separate it out come voting time. @Reminder on the intent of the program and how these requirements should be viewed: Remember the goal is not 100% screen accuracy or prop replication, but to have a higher bar than EI. The reason is that while we understand that some want prop replication, there are 1800 Legion members who aren't even at EI yet, so we want to ensure that this isn't so far out that only a few people get it. * ANH in particular is rife with errors, flubs, and inconsistancies that are non-intentional in nature. For lone instance a trooper without tube stripes or a thermal detonator are considered unintentional. * 501st requirements aren't intented to capture every posssible variat of screen seen, just the canonical, representative versions. * As Paul (TrooperMaster) noted, this is a 501st site and we still have to abide by 501st costuming requirements. Paul (TrooperMaster) suggested perhaps a different award for prop replication, and I think that is a more sensible alternative to trying to make Centurion that role as we could then allow it to vary from 501st requirements, because at that point you are trying to capture a specific screen seen trooper, not a canonical representation of one. Lastly...Pat - mind your manners please. Paul made some very excellent and reasonable suggestions here. Any negative comments on LSD or it's members will be deleted and repeat violations will warrant a suspension.

I'd like to remind everyone that: 1) Centurion builds on EIB, so anything required for EIB is required for Centurion. 2) Because EI/Centurion can only build on the 501st standards, if an element is a requirement for 501st standards it must be for EI/Centurion. 3) The goal of Centurion - like EIB - is not strict screen accuracy, prop forgery, or to capture every possible variant of the TK as seen on screen. The intent is to capture the canonical trooper as best we can in a way that is achievable with more effort than EI, but not so much effort as to make it near impossible to achieve. Thus while not every trooper in ANH had a holster it's a required because of item #2, and Legion standards mandate it just like they mandate a thermal detonator and tube stripes, and thus EI/Centurion must as well. And, it's why Centurion requires 8 teeth cut out because both the EI requires it to be. Also, it's why side gaps are required because they are for EI. While EI allowed most any time of shim, Centurion being a higher standard should - if it lends itself to higher accuracy - be even more stringent.

Requirements and discussion posted at : http://forum.whitearmor.net/index.php?showtopic=14766

OK troops! This thread is to discuss the proposed Centurion standards below: http://www.whitearmor.net/home/crl2wip/124_Stormtrooper_ANH_Stunt/content124.xml Remember the goal is not prop replication, but we are trying to get beyond EI. Questions? Comments? Post away! NOTE: please keep mind this is for ANH STUNT, so the requirements for Hero, ESB, etc. may be different.

QFT! Hopefully in time for my birthday. Can't wait to see 'em!

Like this? (courtesy Synaptyx)

MEPD has their requirements list already set. We're *this* close to doing so for Centurion. We'll roll out ANH Stunt first, followed fast by the rest of the canon costumes. Keep an eye on this forum as we're reformatting *all* of the requirements lists in to one spot to make it easier to see. When the time comes, there will be a separate request thread, just like for EIB. Almost there...

WHAT HAPPENED? Both MEPD and FISD have had above-and-beyond programs for a quite time and SpecOps is in the process of establishing theirs. In all cases, the intent of these programs is to be viewed as an optional set of requirements for those who wish to take the accuracy of their costumes to the next level, and be recognized accordingly. The requirements do not replace or supersede 501st standards, and instead serve as an inspiration for the next level of accuracy that can be achieved. The standards are meant to be high but achievable, rather than focusing on the pinnacle of screen accuracy. While these programs have been successful (2 out of 3 Legion sandtroopers are MEPD Police Officers, over 150 FISD Expert Infantryman), we recognize that as the state of the art for stormtrooper-based costuming has evolved and more information is available on how the original props were made, there is a group of costumers who want a higher bar to reach for. THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK! Rather than increasing the current program standards to a level only a few can achieve or else not providing any guidance for those with the accuracy bug, MEPD and FISD have decided to work in concert to help promote the highest standards of costuming. Given how much the base costumes have in common, keeping the detachment-specific programs in harmony will help reduce confusion among Legion members. Consider the 501st standards being the "must haves" and the original detachment programs as the first step of "should haves". In the new programs the "should haves" become "must haves", and closer attention is paid to every visible detail. NOTE: While there are those who aspire to it, these new designations are not meant to be a leap into "prop forgery". There will be no concern for what sort of strapping system is used, what connectors are made of, or what sort of plastic helmets and armor are pulled from. The focus will instead rest on the outward appearance of the costume, e.g. are there rivets on the sides where they should be and so on. "Prop forgery" has its place and may one day have its own recognition programs, but these are not it. The MEPD's new designation will be "S.W.A.T."; in keeping with the "police force" spin of the detachment. Just as those who are deployed have gone one step beyond the Legion requirements, the "S.W.A.T." designation will be awarded to those members who have gone the extra effort beyond Police Officer status. S.W.A.T are elite paramilitary tactical units in American law enforcement departments as well as some foreign police departments. They are trained to perform high-risk operations that fall outside of the abilities of regular officers. A SWAT team is often equipped with specialized firearms and equipment." -- Source: Wikipedia In keeping with the infantry theme of FISD's "Expert Infantryman" program and also drawing from the word "Legion", FISD will create the Centurion program. Centurions often suffered heavy casualties in battle, generally fighting alongside the legionaries they commanded. They usually led from the front, occupying a position at the front right of the century formation. They led and inspired their men by example. They also sought to display the skill and courage that may have brought them to their rank in the first place. It is for these reasons that they often suffered a disproportionate number of casualties. -- Source: Wikipedia WHERE CAN I LEARN MORE? The final details and requirements are still being put on each program. MEPD will roll the SWAT program out first (as befits the sandtroopers expeditionary nature) with FISD's Centurion program soon thaereafter. We highly recommend you visit your favorite detachment to keep up to date, as these programs will evolve throughout the spring. MEPD: http://forum.mepd.net/index.php?showforum=44 FISD: http://forum.whitearmor.net/index.php?showforum=66 SOUNDS COOL! It is! Clearly these programs will not appeal to every trooper in the Legion, but even if it's not your kind of blaster it's all meant to be fun in the end. Those that choose to push the accuracy bounds actually to everyone a service by inspiring others of what is possible. With unquestioned loyalty, TK-8020 "Daetrin" (FISD Detachment Leader) Fighting Dirty, TD-8541 "Bluey" (MEPD Detachment Leader)

Welcome Emperor Palpatine It's great to see a former DL and CRL Liaison in such a high profile role in the Legion, and we take confidence in your positive track record in both jobs that you'll be an equally effective LXO. As always FISD's mission is to serve the Legion and Empire and you'll find us, With unquestioned loyalty, TK-8020 "Daetrin"

"Tac Officer! Tac Officer! Have those ESB screen grabs reported in?"

Ugh, I cringe when I read that. I'd rather believe that TK armor was pretty durable and able to stop standard blaster bolts for civilian grade weapons. Our troopers go down becuase they are either: 1) Shot with another E-11, which is military grade 2) Shot by Han, who probably uses non-legal hardware Just like a bullet proof vest will stop normal rounds, but perhaps Han & the military are using the SW version of teflon coated ones.

Having you here has been a real blessing Pat. It's great to laugh and be reminded of the lighter side of life And, you also have really helped in a lot of good advice threads too - the best of both worlds.

Or the inverse. No helmet, missing body armor. Doesn't seem a recipe for longevity on the battlefield LOL