Bucket Philosophy

[cr4nky]

I started out wanting to be the idealized trooper, and I'm already now leaning more towards screen accurate after spending much time reading on this forum. My armor hasn't even arrived yet, so i guess my first one will go in the direction of screen accurate from the start:-)

 

I guess I wanted idealized since that was what the movies gave me when watching them just as entertainment, but after learning more about it all I started seeing it on-screen as well, and picking up on all the differences between each trooper it kinda felt natural going for screen accurate on my armor as well.

 

Now I just gotta get my plastic and start building.

 

BTW: Going on my first troop in a borrowed TK this saturday for the pre-launch of Clone Wars, hopefully I'll have time to see it than as well.

[XNtr3k]

Now I just gotta get my plastic and start building.

 

Hear hear, my sentiments exactly.

[Tanasoo]

Well, I agree with Gino. And I think controlled sloppyness is a good term.

 

The only way I can see myself ever getting a screen accurate piece, would be just to have a screen accurate one...

 

 

I might be run out of here for saying this, but being a CG artist myself, I love the CG in the newer movies. It is one of the main reasons that I go to a movie nowadays is to see the CG in them. So I may be a little bit biased

[Murray1134[501st]]

Personally, I'm in the middle between the two camps. But, like Gino said I can see myself not staying in the middle. I've only been at this for a few months now, but I can see so much more now in the films and in what people are wearing. I like the scuffs, scratches and marks that are on my armor. I think it gives it more character and makes it look like it's actually been out there in the field and not sitting in a rubbermaid tub in my living room.

 

On a somewhat related note, I was looking at some of the new Clone Wars books at the store the other day. Something in one of them caught my eye and has stuck with me. In the movie and TV show the clones have a slang for new recruits "Shineys" because they haven't been out in battle yet and the armor is still all perfect and clean.

[TK8114[TK]]

In the movie and TV show the clones have a slang for new recruits "Shineys" because they haven't been out in battle yet and the armor is still all perfect and clean.

 

Yeah I saw that, but IMHO that shows a large difference between the ideology of the organizations of the republic vs the empire. The clones are more individual even though they're clones and what not, the Imperials are all about order and lack of individuality even though they're at least mostly normal humans. Look throughout the OT, in general the Troopers are more or less all spotless (again obviously disregarding sandys), even in the jungles of Endor when realistically they should be scratches and foliage stains from head to toe from trooping in a dense jungle, but they're not because it doesn't thematically represent the Empire. Its not realistic, but its not supposed to be its a movie.

 

Then you look at the clones and they're banged up and dirty like thirty seconds into the battle of Geonosis. Its all there for a reason. The TKs are stark and pristine in a worn and dirty universe to show the sheer strictness of the Imperial Order under Palpatine, its to show his tight fist and to show the difference of his oppression on the normal people of the galaxy. But thats all symbolism whose only real place in this discussion is that its the symbolisms of Star Wars that I choose to pay tribute to in my armor. Its part of what I love about the universe and this time frame of the saga.

[Midnight Trooper]

I agree with alot of what Gino says.

 

In my opinion screen accurate is the only way to go.

Your brain likes asymmetry. The real armor and helmets are far from symmetrical and that is the least of their flaws. They have glue spots, chips, rivets, and cracks all over the place. Yet I believe far more people like stormtrooper armor than clone trooper armor.

 

Everyone feels the desire to correct the bumps at some point, even us screen accurate diehards. But if thats the way the helmets actually were thats the way they should be made for authenticity.

 

But hey if you want to be screen accurate and still be nice and shiny, be a hero helmet trooper. There are far less bumps on that helmet.

 

Just dont do FX or symmetrical armor. Please!

[baron von blondle]

If you want something that "is" a stormtrooper, then idealized is more the route to go. Outside of TD's, imperial equipment is supposed to be ideally pretty pristine and orderly and really nowhere is that more evident than Stormtrooper armor (than maybe those spotless Death Star corridors), in comparison to the dirty, beat up Rebels.

 

just for the record thats my sentiments too.

 

Respect

P.

[Smitty]

My take on this: Go with the best of both worlds. I like my TK suit to look like an average of all the TK's in the OT. A TK missing a knee plate was a mistake, the asymmetricalness of the helmets were not a mistake. Ear gaps wouldnt be on real armor so I filled my gaps with bondo. But it still has the asymmetricalness (thats the second time Ive used that word and I really dont think it even exists) of the original. My goal is to look like Im wearing Stormtrooper armor not a Stormtrooper costume.

 

Not a big fan of FX helmets. I do like the MRCE's tho because with enuff elbow grease and a little heat induced reshaping they can look pretty original. I am very disapponted with the symmetrical approach MR took with most of thier helmets.

 

Dot get me started on the prequels. I hate CG with a passion. There isnt a part in the prequels that can hold a candle to the one moment in ESB where Vader say's "No, I am your father." I'm gonna stop before I end up writing my next college thesis on why OT > the Prequels.

[TK8114[TK]]

A TK missing a knee plate was a mistake, the asymmetricalness of the helmets were not a mistake.

 

Its not a mistake, you're right but its still a flaw. The assymmetrical nature of the helmets is due to the fact that they're hand made film props made 30 years ago. Its impossible for them to be perfect, especially when you step back and look at it and realize almost nobody will ever notice anyways and really before ANH was made nobody though anyone would care.

[Smitty]

The assymmetrical nature of the helmets is due to the fact that they're hand made film props made 30 years ago.

 

IMO thats exactly what CG stuff is missing, that real world organic feel.

[missingpieces[501st]]

Its not a mistake, you're right but its still a flaw.

 

forgetting to put a part on in assembly or replacing it after / if it broke off is a mistake. so is forgetting tube stripes.

 

mistake: an error in action, calculation, opinion, or judgment caused by poor reasoning, carelessness, insufficient knowledge, etc.

 

flaw: a feature that mars the perfection of something; defect; fault.

 

[GINO]

When I refer to screen accuracy, I'm not talking about anomalies such as no tube stripes, or missing bicept, etc...

I'm talking about things that can for the most part hold true across the board. Especially when there are so many.

[TomG[501st]]

I don´t think, that way from "idealized" armor to "screen accurate" is only way. It is only about that, when you switch from costume fan to prop collector and then you demand "screen accuracy". Idealy armor and helmet used in movies and if you don´t have opportunity and money to buy it. Then you want at least some copy of it that looks same with every mistake from creators. And you are prepared to pay for it same price as for whole armor that probably will be not that perfect.

Because another collectors demand same thing and will pay for it too.

Somebody who is not collector can´t tell what is real prop and what is the best copy of it. And you are proud of it, that you can have it and it makes you happy.

 

You see, I´m not collector and I think as prop maker and CGI artist, that they would make these armor perfect, if they can, 30 years ago. They did, what was the best, that they can do with this budged and time. And we love it. Symetrical or Asymetrical. Common SW fan doesn´t know that stormtrooper helmet is asymetrical. We know it and we know why. Stormtroopers were pride of empire, they have to look same, symetrical and perfect. As clones seen in prequels. You said, it looks unnatural, yeah true. But it is natural have army of clones of one man? But can be real. They were clones with same perfect armor, but every of them has own mind and different battle experience and if you meet then in battle, they will be not same. Even if they have primary numbers not names. Then if they look unreal, it was mistake from creators. It wasn´t important for them.

 

This is why, I will try achieve, that my sandtrooper will look more real and not as cheap costume.

 

Some of you, can tell, I don´t know nothing about collecting. My father collect coins more than 20. years and you can´t live with somebody like him without knowing nothing about this.

[TK8114[TK]]

forgetting to put a part on in assembly or replacing it after / if it broke off is a mistake. so is forgetting tube stripes.

 

mistake: an error in action, calculation, opinion, or judgment caused by poor reasoning, carelessness, insufficient knowledge, etc.

 

flaw: a feature that mars the perfection of something; defect; fault.

 

 

That is what I said.

[TK8114[TK]]

IMO thats exactly what CG stuff is missing, that real world organic feel.

 

Ehh, I think it just has to do with the fact that no matter what CG still looks CG. Its got little to do with missing the character of hand made helmets and more to do with the fact that the technology is still not completely there to make it completely life like.

[TomG[501st]]

Ehh, I think it just has to do with the fact that no matter what CG still looks CG. Its got little to do with missing the character of hand made helmets and more to do with the fact that the technology is still not completely there to make it completely life like.

 

Yeah, this is true. But when time comes, technology touch magic

[Tanasoo]

Ehh, I think it just has to do with the fact that no matter what CG still looks CG. Its got little to do with missing the character of hand made helmets and more to do with the fact that the technology is still not completely there to make it completely life like.

 

Exactly. If the artists wanted it to be a-symmetrical, it would be. In fact if the artists wanted to, they could just make a 3d scan of the armor, and with today's technology (not the tech from a few years back) you would be hard pressed to tell the difference

 

As for the organic real world feel point. the military helmets made today are symmetrical, wouldn't they be able to be with starwars tech? We are talking about helmets here, not faces.

 

Imagine how all this would be if the molds had not collapsed, and the screen used helmets turned out symmetrical I can also guarantee that if the movies were made today, the helmets would be symmetrical.

 

Here is how I see it. If you want to make storm trooper armor, they it should be symmetrical. If you want to replicate the storm trooper armor prop, they make a-symmetrical.

 

Both will probably take the same skill and dedication to make. And both, if well done, should deserve the same amount of credit.

[GINO]

Any asymmetry in the trooper parts is not because of any molds collapsing. It's the way they were sculpted. Whoever first said that didn't know what they were talking about.

[XNtr3k]

I drove my sandcrawler over the original molds. Sorry.

[GINO]

Don't be sorry, they look better this way.

[Tanasoo]

Any asymmetry in the trooper parts is not because of any molds collapsing. It's the way they were sculpted. Whoever first said that didn't know what they were talking about.

 

=x I stand corrected. I think I got that from Starwarshelmets.com but I don't know if that's where it originated. I always thought it was kind of funny that a mold would collapse <_<

 

I'm not sure how they could sculpt something that off... Maybe it was intentional Maybe someone should ask the original sculpter...

[GINO]

I don't think the average SW fan even realized when they watch the films that vader, troopers, fett, etc... are asymmetrical at all.

If it's not broken, don't fix it I say.

When you make them symmetrical, then all of a sudden they don't look like what you remember.

Someone should do a symmetry test with trooper, vader, fett, so you can see how much different (and badly) they look side by side with the originals.

[Smitty]

Ive seen the symmetrical versions of Vader and the TK helmets, youre right they look nothing like the originals. Never persued that aspect with Fetts.

 

The aforementioned mold collapsing was why most of the ROTJ helmets look like poodoo.

[GINO]

That's actually an incorrect myth.

The rotj helmets are extremely close to the ANH versions minus a few minor details and an overall increase in softness. I'm talking about the formed parts, not the detailing or accessories.

If you saw a side by side of ANH helmet right next to ROTJ I think you would be very surprised how they look almost the same.

[Smitty]

There's too many myths in this hobby. ROTJ still look like crap compared to ESB and ANH in my opinion. It just looks like they got really sloppy and lazy at the close of the trilogy...or at least focused on things other than TK's. Ilike the TB's tho, cuz its a cool costume...and you can sit down in it.