Dutch Weapon Law Restrictions

[Merugear]

Today I recieved this in my PM box. Out of respect to the sender, he or she shall remain anonymous.

 

Do you not think that considering the shucks storm your ill advised actions ( actions I might add you were warned against taking on the open forum ,re the Dutch garrison and blasters) , that the posting of an apology is in order?

 

You seem to have enough time to post an essay to try to win a helmet but not enough time or respect for your fellow troopers to post up a simlpe " I'm sorry, I fracked up"!

 

You do realise that your actions are having ramifications for more than just the D G but for the whole 501st don't you?

The fact that you approached the belgion garrison due to the fact that "the D G is too strict" has made a LOT of people feel that there was a certain amount of maliciousness involved. NOT a view I would subscribe to , but I can see why they would jump to such a conclusion.

 

Time to be a man and face the music vincent. Your fellow troopers will respect you all the more for it.

 

Respectfully

 

First of all this unfortunate series of events has (as I am aware of) only affected the people of the Dutch Garrisson.

On the day the news reached me that several of the Dutch Garrisson's troops had been forced to turn in their blasters, I contacted the Garrisson's CO. I offered my apology to all of them, that I truly (and some might not believe this) did not expect this to happen. I know how much time, money and effort goes into building those blasters.

 

Malice

Some might have read what I intended as gaudiness in my posts in this topic as malice.

This is the unfortunate disadvantage of textual communication.

Where the fable of me approaching the Belgian Garrisson has come from, I can only guess.

I for one have not contacted anyone of the 501st for admission to the group, as I've been coping with kidneystones and what not.

Several posts in this topic, speculating on what my future actions might be (were the DG disallow my acceptance in the 501st) might have been the source for this rumour,

but they are just that; speculations.

 

I have not recieved any communications from the DG concerning acceptance or whatnot after I have made my apology, so please do not run ahead on the facts for the sake of all of us.

 

Too strict?

Concerning the 'The DG is too strict' rumour. Nonsense. The only comment I have at times made on this is that my personal opinion was that the DG wasn't the most pro-active Garrisson in helping out new troopers to the ranks, compared to what I saw from for example the UKG with armor parties, or letting aspiring members in on their forum to ask questions or such. This was perhaps bratty and naïeve, but it is nothing that concerns you all since it is my personal preference.

This is, as you and I all might agree on, no reason at allto willfully screw them over by tattling to the feds as some might see this action.

 

All this correspondance was done out of a worry for legality. This correspondance was recorded on the open forums as a courtesy for new troopers like me, as well as troops visiting the Netherlands, how the law works here, just so all of us Star Wars geeks don't have to turn in our 1000$/blood/sweat/tears toy gun if you're visiting The Netherlands, since we're part of the strangest countries in the world regarding the legal system (softdrugs and demilled weapons YES / Toy guns with resin greeblies NO ).

I was in the vain hope of trying to make a difference for us troopers here. Was it my place to do so? Perhaps not.

 

Personal

This was a personal effort, not one of the 501st. This was a personal question to the Department of Justice. They used it to make an example to everyone, so they'd think twice on walking around with a blaster in the Netherlands. Some news-sources might indicate the aspiring member had tipped off the local police on the event. Again, nonsense.

I had no ideathey were trooping in Ede, and all the correspondance I have had is right here in this topic, translated to English for all your convenience.

They took their own actions.

 

Assumptions

Some might go: Good job plunker, you just woke a truckload of sleeping dogs! Thanks for messing up for all of us! You hurt the 501st! We told you not to do it!

I can relate to that.

I took steps I thought the local 501st had allready taken. I saw no harm in getting an official confirmation so I could walk around in full costume with a blaster without having to worry on getting my butt busted by the police for doing so. Since the 501st is the Star Wars costuming group, and I knew they always walked around with blasters without a problem what else would I have referenced to? There are heaps of re-enactment groups here that use demilled weapons, I just assumed the 501st fell under that category.

I just assumed a high-profile international charitable organisation full of adults had their laws in check. Is that so naiëve to assume?

 

The correspondance was shared with the Dutch CO and this was done way before the actions of the dutch police happened. There was no way they couldn't know about the legislation back then. So if some of you want to point fingers at me for being a snitch. Go ahead. I am just stating facts here, do with them what you want.

 

Duality

The duality of all this makes it hard to actually be clear to all of you about my feelings on this, but I will try to make it as clear as possible.

 

Again, I feel very very sorry for those who lost their weapons and I truly hope they get away with just a warning. It sucks massively that so much effort has gone to waste.

I never wanted to appear maliced or appear being against the DG. I never wanted to screw you guys over, I just wanted clarity on the matter.

 

As you can read from my correspondence I too wanted it to work. I too wanted to walk around with a blaster. For heck's sake, that's the reason why I tried to bring up reasons for allowance in the first place! It might not have been my place to do so, and for that I am sorry. I just wanted to make a difference, and in a distorted kind of way I did. Though I wished it would've gone the other way around.

 

Why I didn't reply

 

The reason for me not replying to all of this earlier is simple. This was between the DG and me. I apologised to them. That some of you suffer from collateral shock cos of this action, that's your issue. So far no news of other troopers getting arrested have reached me, nor has any 501st official stepped up to play the blame-game with me. As said earlier, aspiring members have no access to the 501st or DG forums, so I am and was limited to e-mail correspondence, FISD and MEPD forums and hearsay.

It was not neccesary to apologise to all of you in here, as not all of you are affected by this.

 

I think most of us live in a fair country, so if you get arrested for illegal weapons use outside the Netherlands cos of all of this, you should turn that finger you're pointing at me 180 degrees and realise that you should've paid more attention to your local laws in the first place.

 

Vincent

[89Batman[TK]]

Vincent I have followed all of this quite carefully and I have to say that although I think you were more than a little stupid to have attempted this crusade I truly believe you had good intentions. The ramifications of your actions are being felt right now but maybe the DG. CO. can repair the damage you have done so that they may again use their blasters, who knows he may even work something out with them so blasters may be carried again- I've met him and I wouldn't be at all surprised if he did just that!

I have just returned from trooping with the Dutch Garrison at the Elf fantasy fayre in Arcen castle this weekend and I have to say they are a great bunch of people, I'm sure there are those who may feel a little annoyed at your actions, particularly when you were advised by many not to pursue your course of action, but I would hope they would be forgiving enough to accept you and help you continue with your dream of trooping. They are a very friendly bunch and alot of fun to troop with.

I trooped at a Castle with a Hasbro blaster this weekend whilst people walked around the grounds with seriously dangerous weapons ( I actually saw one guy carrying a serrated edge sword that was so big he had to carry it above his head!!!!) The police were not at all concerned with this just concerned that the orange tips were there on our toy guns! Wow it really was a strange. The guys over there are great and I even met a couple of the guys who lost there blasters but none of them, including the guys that lost their blasters, are going to let that stop them trooping and raising so much money for charity!

I hope everyone can move on beyond this and start to concentrate on how to repair rather than continue to blame one man for a mistake he seems only too well aware of.

[Amish Trooper]

"I think you were more than a little stupid to have attempted this crusade" BS..I think it takes a smart and proactive person to take the first step. I can't believe that people are asking a person who was following the law to say he is sorry because they got caught breaking it. WTF

[Dargas[501st]]

something of this magnitude is, at least, a very hard thing to pass by, specially for people that lost their priced possessions and face a possible fine. But once again, i have to agree here, that it was bound to happen sometime since its the law we are talking about.

 

I feel sorry for you Vincent, you are an OK guy in my book and I can fully understand what drove you to do this just as I can understand the guys that lost their props.

 

we must all hope for the best here, no Ill intentions drove this issue into being.

 

to Err is Human, to forgive is divine.

[Deaths Messengr]

wow dude. that sucks.... To be honest when i started reading this thread, my first thought was "crap, i hope they don't raid an event..."

 

my first response was going to be advice to seek out the DG's advice on how to continue, but then i realized it was 3 pages, not one. I truly am sorry that this has occured, and while i'm not a trooper yet, I offer my condolences to our Dutch brethren.

[Dutch Bly]

Hi ,

 

I'm Gino a member from the Dutch Garrison, I've been with the Garrison ever since it was a small 4 member outpost back in 2005.....I've walked the six mile Roseparade in armor in 2007....still trooping and going strong.

 

I'm just posting my two cents over here.

 

The main thing i would like to point out that thanks to these kind of actions of curiousity(that's what I would like to call it) whether it was done intentionally or not, anytime soon you won't be able to do anything anymore in a country like the Netherlands.

 

It's not about being accepted within the Dutch Garrison or not, it's about keeping the harmony within the group, it's very difficult to connect with new members this way.

 

I have to be honest about this, I'm just saying I can understand there is a very sour feeling at the moment within the Garrison, as our intentions were about entertaining ill children in Tilburg (not Ede).

 

I didn't troop that day, but the feelling that certain things are starting to become impossible to do in the name of a good cause , like charity for instance, starts to freak the hell out of me.

 

What next! ......... forbidden to walk around in armor???.....it'll probably end-up with that.

 

I'm not trying to make a statement here, but come on what is it all about people.....is it really about those hasbro toys?????meant for children ages 6 and up?????iff they look like sterlings....even if they were modified!!!people must have been very blind anyhow!

 

This is what happened to me 3 years ago, I was judged before a court because of it , even the judge found it pathetic!!! all he could give me was 2 years on parole for being creative!

 

[TK-2126_MD[TK]]

This is what happened to me 3 years ago, I was judged before a court because of it , even the judge found it pathetic!!! all he could give me was 2 years on parole for being creative!

 

 

!!!!! 2 yrs for building a Hoth Tripod Blaster!!!!! And i thought my Country was F___ up!!!!??? Good Lord thats mess up, who comes up with theses laws!!!!

So your tripod broke what law? Looking like a big gun?

[Dutch Bly]

No for looking like an anti aircraft gun.....

 

Anyway the liquer-store guy from across the street waited 4 days before contacting the police about it and pointed out that the gun was pointed in my neighbours direction, as if to say that I would have somekind of grutch against my neighbour , which I didn't whatsoever.

 

Anyway, what i'm saying is that it's all about tolerence these days, which seems to disappear more and more, also because of the silly laws......why???

 

Everybody is supposedly scared after the 911 catastrofe, on one hand i understand it very well because the whole world got shocked because of this, but on the other hand it's typical for the Netherlands , a country that's supposed to stand for "freedom of expression" , with the weed capital of the World, yet toyguns are strictly prohibited.

 

Where is the "Freedom of Expression" now!!??

[Sgt JB]

Freedom is usually an illusion those with power allow those without to have, to keep them from taking said power.

[tigger68[501st]]

I've tried to stay out of this controversy as I felt it didn't apply to me and although I can see both sides, I have to say that in many ways I support the actions of the person who was asking the questions. The fact that the laws are so weird, and even though I don't know the Dutch legal system, perhaps this is the time to look at changing the law???? I know that in the U.S. we could bring up a court case and perhaps even have it go before the highest court in the land. I know I would be concerned about being caught with an illegal prop weapon in a country with very strict weapons laws.

 

That being said, toy guns are being used in crimes everywhere. How many of the TK's will remove their orange plug to look "more screen accurate" for their costumes? How many of us will remove the guts from inside our hasbro blasters? If it can be opened, and modified, I'm sure someone will do it, and make it so that it fires real projectiles, whether intended for that purpose orignally or not.

 

As for trooping in hospitals with weapons. I'm sure that if you contact the hospital, talk with the head of security, and possibly even the persons responsible for the event, they would allow you to bring your blasters with you. You may have to have them examined thoroughly upon entering and have a sticker applied saying that they had been examined (sticker can be removed) but I think that would be a small price to pay. If the hospital or event decides that having the blasters there would not be allowed, would you really not partcipate? Is it about the blasters or the children? If a child asks you where your blaster is, just say they aren't allowed in the medical bay, but not to worry, you are just as effective without it. As a hospital employee, I wouldn't have a problem with a stormtrooper carrying a blaster, but again, I've had a close friend shot by someone who smuggled in what looked like a toy weapon modified to fire real projectiles, so I can see the reason for the total weapons ban.

 

Okay, I'm jumping off my soap box now, and will try and keep things light and airy from now on...

[Dutch Bly]

Just like a ballpoint or a fountain pen can be made to fire aswell , It's just a matter of how well you can hide something , when using it with the wrong intentions, but i don't remember ever having any wrong intentions......

 

Have we finally come this far that our government sees everyone as a potential criminal........Just to be safe?

 

Does that seem fare to you?

[Sgt JB]

Just like a ballpoint or a fountain pen can be made to fire aswell , It's just a matter of how well you can hide something , when using it with the wrong intentions, but i don't remember ever having any wrong intentions......

 

Have we finally come this far that our government sees everyone as a potential criminal........Just to be safe?

 

Does that seem fare to you?

 

 

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin

[TK5560[TK]]

First of all, many thank to all who have support the DG! We got some very cool responses and sympathy, so thanks The support of fellow troopers makes it a bit easier to deal with these circumstances.

 

Let me put an update here, not to start the discussion agina. All is said and done, and what the next steps will be depends on all parties involved.

 

The case is now under the attention of the DA. He can and will rule about the issue. The troopers who got their blasters taken anway can expect anything from a fain ($250) or even a house visit.

 

For the DG, we are under the attention of the police. Our CO and me have asked all DG troopers to leave any plastic blasters at home. For an unknown period we are very carefull because to police just might visit us again. So, it has taken some fun away from trooping

for other garrisons trooping in Holland, please be aware of the issue. On our multi-garrison event some weeks ago we asked foreign troopers to not take their plastic blasters with them. That also takes a bit of fun away for them

 

I want to make it clear that there was no contact or exchange of information between Vincent and the (council of the) DG. On one occassion our CO asked Vincent not to pursue the issue, but he did as we all know now.

Vincent has not made an officially appology towards the DG and its memers, nor has he officially assigned to the 501st/DG at this moment.

 

 

John

XO Dutch Garrison

[Merugear]

To John, the DG and whoever feels affected by my actions:

 

The CO did tell me not to wake the sleeping dogs but I probably did, even before I contacted him about it.

I regret doing that, in such a way, that it has cost some people their investments and credibility and got them into trouble with the authorities.

I am sorry for them to have been put in this predicament, as this was not my intention from the get-go. I just wanted clarity from the authorities.

 

On the other hand I think that it's every Dutchman's duty to know the law, and therefore I still believe I was doing the right thing. Even if you help out sick kids and walk around in armor... Wearing white armor makes you stand out above the crowd. It does not, however, make you stand above the law. Emphasizing on the CO having warned me against asking the LEGAL authorities kinda puts all of this in an odd perspective:

 

The young IT geek who wants to become a stormtrooper and asks the legal authorities if it's ok to bear toy guns

just for the simple fact that he doesn't want to get his white plastic bottom harrassed when walking around with it

 

is being warned by the

 

local chapter of a worldwide charitable costume organisation condoned by a multi billion dollar franchiseholder

who is directly affected by bad PR if the costume group messes up their public image somehow

 

not to inquire the local authorities on their weapons law, cos they're all willingly walking around with illegal props and do not want to get busted.

 

The only thing I blame myself for is that I've spent over 1000 euros and hours on friggin plastic, strapping and tupperware just to alienate myself from the group I am trying to belong to in the first place, just by thinking I was doing the right thing.

 

I mean, you're all high profile, and every layman would see your gun as real if you're not covering yourself up in plastic and shout at them with it. And for that very same reason they're illegal here. And have been for quite some time I might add. So I thought all of you had your legality in check. Correspondance with the CO was slow for a while, and not having access to the forums, I decided to detour and ask the source of it all, namely 'Postbus 51', which is the national front-office for day-to-day questions regarding government policies.

 

 

 

It's not that I bashed the Minister of Justice's door in shouting ¡¡OMG GUNZ!1!! allthewhile dragging police officers to event locations just to rat you people out or anything.

 

It sucks bigtime to see such an investment in both time and money go to waste so easily, especially in times like these, and I truly feel bad for those who've gotten into more trouble because of this than they should have. I, like the majority of people, too think the authorities over-reacted. An official warning would've done the same. Even allowing the DG to turn in, or de-modify their props to make them legal again would've been a better course of action.

 

Though I want to make one thing clear: It is not myfault this happened.

I do not need to apologise for ANYTHING.

 

If some people don't want me in their club cos mommy took away their cookie just for the simple fact that I asked mommy if it was ok to have a cookie just like theirs and they weren't supposed to have them in the first place... Fine.

 

It would just show what kind of people I'd be dealing with were I allowed to join.

 

To those still mad at me:

Don't go all crusadey and offended, cos in the end it was their own decision to buy the bloody things and to walk around with them feeling awesome.

It was the police's decision to apprehend them and to put a fine on it all. Be mad at them, not me.

 

I'm just a simple guy who did what he thought was right.

 

To the members of the DG:

 

I am sorry that all of this has gotten some of you into trouble. I just hope we can mend the wounds that have been made,

so that we all can see what we're really about: Having fun with eachother and being the best darn tooting stormtroopers there's ever been.

 

If not, I hope there's any Garrisson out there that is willing to take me in instead .

 

Vincent

[Dutch Bly]

It's not the point that you can't be accepted by the Dutch Garrison, the point is about trust, we have a close bond with all the members, few of us see this as "a wiseguy act" by not folowing up advice, You knew about the law in the first place, if you would have kept your mouth shut, we (my fellow troopers that day) wouldn't have this kind of trouble, and about taking up contact with the DG afterworth, you didn't do that either.

 

It was about the advice you didn't take, I guess that was what hurt our group the most, the trust!

 

I don't know you, and have no direct reason to dislike you, but it will certainly stay in my mind what happened, there are fellow members who think you should get a second chance, not because you wouldn't be accepted, just so you can get a chance to be accepted within the group.

 

So you'll get another chance, that's what they're saying.

 

So it's all about the advice which was given to you, I hope you understand this.

[Sgt JB]

Vincent, I tried to be on your side throughout all this, I really did. I don't think I can anymore.

 

You were asked to drop it, you didn't. The Legion by-laws state that the costume must meet 501st standards WITHIN applicable local laws. (I'm paraphrasing here) You continued to push the issue after you were given the "NO you can't have your toy gun" answer about a dozen times from the ministry. What did you think they were going to do? Especially affter you posted links to the 501st and Garrison websites in your e-mails. No matter what your intentions were, you went about it the wrong way. You didn't think of the consequences. What if LFL gets wind of this? What do you think would have been their stance on this if it had made CNN? You should consider yourself lucky that guys who lost alot of $ and time because of you are willing to give you a 2nd chance. I agree with the premise of what you did. Just not how you carried it out.

 

Also, your 'Don't blame me" attitude isn't going to win you any friends on the matter either. A little humility here might be in order.

[Werstrooper]

I'm sorry Vincent but I don't think this is the hobbie for you, you can't come on here and defend your actions after you were told to leave it alone

 

Though I want to make one thing clear: It is not myfault this happened.

I do not need to apologise for ANYTHING.

 

If some people don't want me in their club cos mommy took away their cookie just for the simple fact that I asked mommy if it was ok to have a cookie just like theirs and they weren't supposed to have them in the first place... Fine.

 

Comments like this won't get you anywhere, you only look ignorant and immature by putting it like that. Also I personally find it insulting to see it written like that.

 

To those still mad at me:

Don't go all crusadey and offended, cos in the end it was their own decision to buy the bloody things and to walk around with them feeling awesome.

It was the police's decision to apprehend them and to put a fine on it all. Be mad at them, not me.

 

I'm just a simple guy who did what he thought was right.

 

You didn't think, you assumed and we all know what to assume really means. Yes you are simple though, most people that put themselves in high horses usually are.

 

"walk around with them feeling awesome" so what are you implying with this comment?

 

To the members of the DG:

 

I am sorry that all of this has gotten some of you into trouble. I just hope we can mend the wounds that have been made,

so that we all can see what we're really about: Having fun with eachother and being the best darn tooting stormtroopers there's ever been.

 

If not, I hope there's any Garrisson out there that is willing to take me in instead .

 

Vincent

 

Don't apologize here you said yourself you don't owe us an apology you're 'assuming' all the DG members post on this site, only a few post here how abut trying the actual DG forum to put up you apology http://www.dutchoutpost.nl/

 

 

So from what I've read you don't owe us anything so why are you still here?

 

 

I live in Australia but I'm Dutch,so half my opinion is warranted here

[Dutch Bly]

Vincent, I would take the chance while you still can, because i don't know if any other garrisons would gladly take you , if they would know about this.

 

An apology would be at place here, if you still think the 501st is something for you.

 

 

Just my two cents.

[Merugear]

Very well, I apologise. Publicly, officially... Whatever you want.

 

I am sorry for the troopers that have lost their guns, and gotten in to trouble,

 

I am sorry for not thinking things over while I was excited with my armor and toy blaster that came in the mail that I asked the dept. of justice those questions.

 

I am sorry that I am high-horsed, simple and a git.

 

I am sorry that I appeared not to fit in this hobby for some of you.

 

I am sorry that I assumed inquiring local weapons laws was the right thing to do.

 

I am sorry this thread exists and that I have sent those mails.

 

I am sorry that I ruined some of your precious time by posting here.

 

I just want what all of you guys and gals want: to have fun.

 

And this my friends, is not fun.

 

So please, I realize I have done some dumb things,

but be so kind to admit that it's just one side of the coin.

 

I apologise.

 

(if someone could translate this and add it to the DG forums (cos they're MEMBERS ONLY, which is why I haven't posted on it before, Werstrooper. I even asked for admission by mail but it was denied by the CO))

[89Batman[TK]]

Come on everyboby this is starting to leave a bad taste in my mouth! Vincent is clearly sorry for what happened and it is also clear to me that his intentions, however misguided , were good. If the law had been changed as a result of his actions we would all be championing him now- yes he was advised to leave it alone but he thought he could make a difference so he persisted in the vein hope of of achieving something wonderful for the DG. I'm pretty sure we have alll been given good advice by people who have more experience than ourselves and I'm sure we have all thought we knew better and done it our way anyway!!! You would only have to speak to my Dad and I'm sure he will give you a list of the times I didn't listen to him!!!

Remember-Troopers helping Troopers! Let's not spend an age blaming and punishing! Let us instead forgive, learn and move on together!

[Sgt JB]

I don't disagree that he had good intentions, did what he feels is right, and regrets what has happened. I never once felt that what he did was so bad that he shouldn't be included in the Legion. I sincerely hope the DG allows him membership. It was his attitude ex post facto that bothered me. As a recent recruit I can totally see where he was comming from. I still think it's a DG decision, as they're the ones that will be trooping with him.

 

Vincent, the only thing I can say to you is that I was / am 100% behind what you tried to do. I think it's admirable that you tried to do what you did. However, since it all blew up, your attitude has steadily gone south, and I don't want to see that. Even your previous apology post has a condecending ring to it. Nobody here wants to see you do anything but suceed in becoming a member, so keep that in mind.

[Merugear]

I understand, it's just that all of this is getting to me, been getting responses like that for the past 2 months or so. Hectic private life juggling with work, school and work studies (going for my MCITP:SA) not to mention a 4 years lasting court case (hopefully) coming to an end this week regarding an accident that gave me permanent back injury (busdriver fell asleep during holiday trip, and we were in the bus) and the remembrance of my late father-in-law who tragically passed away last January at too young an age. It's just that I didn't mean to cause all this trouble, and am sorry for it. The reason for these (at times) harsh reactions is that I simply had enough on my mind allready apart from people calling me a git and a moron for trying to do the right thing. I may be blunt in voicing my opinion and I am sorry for that, it's just a character flaw I am all too well familiar with.

 

Let's try to make this all a better place for all of us, that's what I intended to do from the start.

 

Cheers,

 

Vincent

[Sgt JB]

Well, I for one hope everything works out for the best. You're a good guy, you're passionate about trooping, and the costuming hobby. That's what's important. Good luck with your application, and I hope it see you in the ranks of the Legion soon.

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Come on everyboby this is starting to leave a bad taste in my mouth! Vincent is clearly sorry for what happened and it is also clear to me that his intentions, however misguided , were good. If the law had been changed as a result of his actions we would all be championing him now- yes he was advised to leave it alone but he thought he could make a difference so he persisted in the vein hope of of achieving something wonderful for the DG. I'm pretty sure we have alll been given good advice by people who have more experience than ourselves and I'm sure we have all thought we knew better and done it our way anyway!!! You would only have to speak to my Dad and I'm sure he will give you a list of the times I didn't listen to him!!!

Remember-Troopers helping Troopers! Let's not spend an age blaming and punishing! Let us instead forgive, learn and move on together!

 

Rock on. What's done is done and local laws are what they are. It could be worse - the Chinese Outpost can't even troop publicly w/o fear of arrest unless they get prior government approval. If you don't like the laws - work to change them.

 

Let's move on folks - there's nothing new being posted in this thread.

[Arcturus[TK]]

Vincent,

 

Its more than just letting people in because their costume is by 501st standards. When a new member wants to join the DG, see it as a job interview. Can you contribute to the Dutch Garrison in a positive way? Can this person be trusted? Does he fit the current team? How will we know, you wont do something like this again?

 

I see you complaining we dont have an open section to our forums. Great idea... why did you not mail it to us through our website instead of complaining in the detachment boards? Actually, we do have a small group that is a corporation with the DG and the Rebel Legion Benelux, namely the Galactic Adademy. A place where troopers to be can get tips on their costumes and what not.. Secondly, a little patience can go a long way.. Look up members on hyves or facebook if you believe our CO makes too little time to answer your mail. Being in the DG council I can assure you, you are not the only mail our CO has to answer.

 

Also, I see you comparing us with the GG and the UKG. While these comparisons are very flattering, the DG just this year became a garrison. We are still a small group, and do not have the numbers the GG or UKG have... So costume parties are ok with me.. Invite me and I will come over... dont expect 50 members though

 

I also see apologies, whereas I see apology rejections in the same post.. What do I have to make of this? And yes, I was one of those troopers who lost their toy blasters.. But it gets worse my dear Vincent:

 

I am also the event officer of the Dutch Garrison, meaning I 'supervise' the events the Dutch Garrison does in a year. Since this all blew up, we had several police visits on other events, to check us out if we didnt break the law again. The police is checking out our public agenda, and is making (announced and unannounced) appearances on behalf of the dep. of justice. So its no fun for you, true, but its certainly not a breeze in the park for us troopers now, is it ? Do I care I lost my blaster? Nope.. I really dont care.. it was a piece of shucks hasbro anyway... The police are checking us out on regular basis is what really bothers me the most... Did you even consider this in your apology?

 

As event officer I have to vouch for the troopers I am placing on events. I am responsible for actions my troopers do at an event, and I want troopers I can trust. Can we still trust you Vincent?

 

I am still in the 'give this chap another chance' camp, although every apology is a bit condescending, which really is a shame, because the people you are apologizing to, are the people you have to troop with... And on some troops, you start at 8:00, and are saying your goodbyes at 22:00, not too mention the weekends of trooping mayhem. You dont want to step in with bad blood between members.. Thats my advice to you.. Do with it what you want..

 

TK-5404

 

Rick Fleuren

Event Officer

Dutch Garrison