TooMuchGarlic

Sold this, shipped it... apparently lost or stolen. If anyone sees anyone with this helmet in their possession, please let me know, as this is to be considered stolen goods! !!!!!NOTICE!!!!! POSSIBLY LOST/STOLEN Please keep an eye out for it, please. Regular Version grey SFS. -------

I would go with AP or TE2. AP for strength and durability. TE2 for accuracy.

I will try and take some pictures to match the reference I've got. One thing I noticed though was that mine has the scratch in the right tube stripe decal like the TE owned helmet, which just makes the discrepancies elsewhere so much more perplexing.

But as I said, the decals don't match up. Mine have sharp corners where they are rounded on the original helmet Matt owned and cut/rounded where they should be sharp/pointy. The tube stripe ends are also trimmed differently towards the front + the vocoder paintwork is different and doesn't go all the way back towards the neck trim, like on the original. I don't think there is one decal outline that matches. It's perplexing, 'cause the bars in the decals seems to match the TE owned helmet... but if all were cut from the same template, then that would explain that similarity. I take it the original was taken apart for making molds? Would mean that the fiberglass mold was made prior to the helmet being taken apart and molded for vac-forming purposes, 'cause the ears are positioned slightly differently, with scratches and glue marks on the original that aren't on mine, if it is indeed from the TE owned helmet... it just seems unlikely with the discrepancies of the decals.

It was while tracing the decal details that I realized it couldn't possibly be from that TE owned original. I wanted to see how much of the original detail was still there... and it turns out that it's a lot... though, there are areas that are completely washed out... the rear area of the left tube stripes, for instance, is completely guesswork, as there's nothing there on the surface to go by... basically the three-four last stripes towards the ear. -----------

A quick update. The cast is not a copy off the previously TE owned Propstore of London helmet. Just wondering what it is off then.

Cool. Thanks for the pictures of your tools. Yup... I think I need to acquire one of those types of scissors. Very clean work you're doing! <_<

That's exactly what I try to do. Either I have unsteady hands, lack of patience or I've got the wrong tools. Got a pic of yours?

Man... how do you get such clean cuts? When I trim anything... my hands look like shish kabob after a few seconds and the trims are rough and curving all over the place.

Yeah, I only have the ones posted in this thread. Would love to see more. Always enjoy looking at original helmets.

Are there anymore good pictures of the Propstore of London helmet?

The TM is the one to the left.

Actually, no. It's much simpler in the model kit community, anything you copy without permission is a recast, even if you alter it - and even if you copy the licensed stuff. It's much more black and white in that community - if it is not a sculpt you made and you mold and cast it, you are recasting. It is the same in the prop community, except we allow the "cast from screen used" variant and in part the copy from licensed depending on whether it is a current license or expired. Some want it tighter like it is in the model kit community, some want it looser, where it is free for all.

Well, the AP comes from a reworked RotJ copy from a real suit. It was reworked from RotJ look into something more closely resembling the ANH look, but since reverse engineering sometimes fail to capture what was originally there, having to work from a changed form is more difficult than one should think. There are NO direct cast from screen used ANH suits available. NONE. They are all reworked from a RotJ suit + spare parts from other sources. It is very clear that a lot of work has been put into the GF suit and the later AP, but they are more idealized suits than some of the others, cleaned up and made more pretty, while still retaining some of what harks back to the originals. Not to get into that debate, but within the community, the word recast is used to label those copying someone else's stuff without permission, while those working with permission or casting from screen used are simply said to be copying or replicating. Big distinction. And the misuse of the word "recasting" is what is causing all these headaches and heated discussions - the term was formed in the model kit community, as far as I know, to label thieves and those copying without permission. Staff, I can easily erase the last clarification, if you'd rather keep all that out of this discussion.

What is this new armor you speak of? Is it the coming Museum Replicas armor?

The soles in those reference pictures are black. JFYI.

It is being looked into in the model kit community to add something to the resin that hinders silicone to cure, but will allow the kit to be painted. And I'm sure that once that has been figured out, it will become available to the prop community to secure fiberglass casts as well. It won't stop recasting, as they'd just switch to more expensive silicones or laser scanning, but at least it adds more burdens to the recasters than they'd probably wanna waste time with it. Their prices will go up, which means you might as well just buy the original piece.

Yeah... but as I mentioned... that reply is flawed... as... those are not available for the masses. They could have been if there had been less acceptance of recasters and recasting here and other 501st boards, but because there isn't, there's no point in making things available, even to a select few. Which means we get less new stuff and just more of the same ol', same ol'. I heard rumors for instance of two all complete original trooper suits that is simply not being made available to anyone because of all this acceptance of recasters from this group. Also other original pieces WILL NOT be made available to anyone and that pisses me off as because of this, I am missing out on stuff - we all are. Sadly, because of the LFL vs AA trial it has become even MORE difficult to find the truth about the origin of these helmets and the molds that made them. We are sorta stuck with the stories from the sellers and what little was possible to get confirmed or debunked. Sure, it is the job of the owner to prove that the story that accompanied the piece is true, but as long as it is not possibly to debunk or disprove that what they claimed is true, you have to go by their story as the proof and what was confirmed. Since we can't get the whole story about many of these items, that is sometimes all we have to go by. We have to accept the history and story attached to a piece until we can fully confirm or deny it or aspects of it. Discounting it simply because it cannot be verified right this minute is a bit premature. You can speculate all you want, but so far, all you know about it is the story attached to it and what was managed to be confirmed and debunked and that's all you can really go by. Nevertheless... they are indeed some cool pieces. They are not shown much so people would see all the cool things about them that simply ARE NOT on any other helmets... and they are only sold to select few, if sold at all. Again, because these leech recasters are accepted and can work freely here.

The fact that the costuming community gets their stuff from the prop community makes it relevant. Don't know if I agree with that. In the last 2 1/2 years we have seen several screen derived Vader helmets become available. Five years ago the GH as a top of the line Vader helmet, and now it's not that desirable unless it's from the master run. With the dawn of the DJ, the three TM versions, SL, and TD Vader helmets the bar has been raised incredibly high in Vader land and these highly sought helmets do come up for sale occasionally. If this is the results of the last 2 years of progress for Vader, which is the mountains peek of SW costuming, I still see a bright future ahead for the prop community as a whole. And who is getting access to those? The whole community or only the few you hope you can trust? May not be screen used, but no proof that they aren't first generation pieces directly from production molds. If you are privvy to some additional knowledge that I'm not aware of, I'd love to hear it. No. Sadly, the analogy doesn't work. Not even the same as this issue. The original cast from screen used producers, molded and cast an original piece to offers to others to buy. With your analogy, then the "recasters" would have molded and cast the same or another original to offer to others to buy. If they did that - no one would have a problem with them selling their wares. The problem arises with the fact that they didn't buy the original, wreck their brain with how to mold it without damaging it, molding it and risking damaging the piece, just so that their effort can be recast by some guy getting a copy of their work. They just took what the other guy had spent loads of money on and risked damaging to offer to the community, and recast it. So... why should the first guy waste any more time on copying the originals he buy to offer to the community if he's just getting recast left and right. No, he loses interest and we all lose out because some people are only interested in their own niche community and applaud recasters who provide them with what they want at cheap prices, with little to no regard on what it does to the rest of the community in terms of new stuff being made available. But trooper people are happy, 'cause they got their trooper armor, so to heck with everyone else, who'd want accurate biker scouts, royal guards, etc. But I guess I'm barking up the wrong tree here... but since those who don't care and applaud recasters come piss up my tree and burn my chances of getting these things, I do get a little aggravated. Yeah, see, I'm selfish that way. If it hadn't been AA, perhaps we would have seen less wonky and different looking helmets in ANH. All speculation though, but the fact remains that AA did a piss-poor job to make the helmets vacced off the same molds look the same. all trooper producers working from the Brian R molds make Brian R helmets and those working from the Dave M molds make Dave M helmets - all pretty unique to those particular helmets. The fact that they can make nearly each one look the same... tells you a little bit about the crap-job AA did for the movie.

I can only say one thing. Wonder why there are no cast from screen used Biker Scout armor and helmets? Wonder why there are no cast from screen used Royal Guard helmets? Wonder why there are no real available über accurate cast from screen used Vader helmets available? Wonder why many things aren't available? It's quite simple. Who wants to feed greedy recasters and buyers of recasts. Who wants to take the risk and damaging an original piece just to feed the greedy, needy, complaining masses who'll just rather turn around and stab you in the back than thank you for taking the time, spending the money, risking damaging an original piece to offer this to you. Who wants that waste of time, when the community doesn't even protect your effort and investment, but just allows others to profit from what you offered and when he tries to complain he just gets a shrug and the words: well, you recast it in the first place, so go cry in a corner. Until recasters buy an original, mold it and sell it at the cheap prices they are selling their recast wares... THEN I'll believe that they aren't doing it for the money, but for the hobby. Until then they can go kiss my furry butt with their lame reasons for recasting... and what is okay in the 501st or costuming community is no means the same as what is okay in the prop community and since the costuming community gets their fix from the prop community... at least show a little more respect to that community - 'cause what was wrong with the FX if it wasn't the costumers wanting something better? The kids wouldn't care crap. The blatant acceptance and non-action against recasters in the costuming community affects BOTH communities as the cool stuff is now not worth for the owners of original pieces to risk molding to bring to the masses. That's what you get from accepting and "approving" these leeches. It affects us all.

Pretty cool looking suit. So, did you guys hear the phrase "Aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper" a lot?

That's not vac-formed - that's fiberglassed.

Cool snatch Kev, looking forward to the pictures!

Nice helmet.

The Meatsock is very thin and soft in the features compared to high-end helmets. You can say you don't support recasting all you want... but if you buy... then you do and you give them reason to continue recasting. Lack of funds really isn't a good argument either when it comes to buying recasts. However, since this is not likely from the original maker and he stopped years ago I really don't see a problem. Hell... the helmet is there... so why not put it to good use, as you seem to have in your plans. I think I would advise against taking it apart, just scrub it clean - without breaking it - and then repaint it as it is, just removing the rubber trims.