TK bondservnt

not yet, but my application is in. I'm just hitting all the bases! so? what do you think?

ESB PHOTOSET front http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshootfront.jpg rt side http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshootright.jpg lt side http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshootleft.jpg back http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshootback.jpg Images reshot after lens/sidegap/belt/shoulder refitting. Ab Button Detail http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/abbuttondetail.jpg correct testors colors Blaster left http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/blasterdetail2.jpg no hengstler Blaster right http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/blasterdetail1.jpg Blaster rear http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/blasterdetail3.jpg working Real D ring, lighted scope Blaster front http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/blasterdetail5.jpg Helmet Detail 1 http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshoot%20001.jpg shows correct details Helmet Detail 2 http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/ESBreshoot%20002.jpg more of correct details. helmet off http://www.metalvideotube.com/starwars/esb%20reshoot/helmetoff.jpg

Ears used to be too thick, tubestripes backwards... small amount of flashing still on eyes. should have no lip. good job on the ears. Other than getting some better mic tips and some rubber trim... I'd also attach a couple of chinstraps with 2 snaps. leather with a topper made of elastic. usually screwed into the longest 6/32, you're well on your way! I'd remove the helmet interior and replace it with a lighter more flexible foam star like in the originals. I've never understood why a trooper would want a batting helmet interior. it's way too heavy to wear. a star foam and a chinstrap keep an AP helmet really light. I usually put a small cage fan right in the frown. the battery and switch fits well inside the tube. if you would like some black frown screen I can help you out. just PM me your Address and I'll send you some.

I really want to thank you for a great tutorial. the aspects you taught me lead me to be a little confused at first. and it taught me a lot about my forearms, and how to fix em. but it looks like troopermaster cleared everything up nicely. it's a very subtle difference in appearance when you overlap the legs and arms as I've seen in a couple of builds. so for an AP build according to the ANH method we have your excellent method. and for a comparable build type you'd have to do the ROTJ mods back onto the armor with the trim on the edges and other subtle mods using the overlap method. it would be like going back to the original sculpt. or at least trying to.

I've got 2 EIB projects. all I need is my AP helmet finished, and all I have to do on that is get some darker lens and paint my vocoder and frown and I'll be doing a dual EIB ANH and ESB all in one shot! a little more work and I'll be completely modded to hero style. happy T day too.. vern

AP kits don't have the same shins. AP kits don't have finishing strips moulded onto the thighs. those concepts are COMPLETELY WRONG the kit can be assembled in either the overlap or butt end join methods. there's a lot of misinformation being shared about the AP kit. my AP kit is number 11... I think panda trooper actually has number 12 my kit's shins, and thighs are all completely different parts. none of them fit together. as for the modifications to the size of the thigh... I don't see any comparison to the FX kit's thighs at all.. so this is another example of a thread with FALSE information being spread as "FACT" all the leg parts... when sorted correctly almost fit perfectly together. the only parts you need to trim are small areas near the bottoms to help line up the parts after you apply some torque to them. the shoulder bells "swoop" when you put them over the bicep in the correct position. the angle of the shoulder bell, and the resulting swoop depends upon 2 factors. the distance of the width of your shoulders creates the angle at the vertical line the width of the bicep armor, when pushed up as High as it can go... creates a spread in the shoulder bell... and this translates to a nice swooped look. the best course of action would be to have an interview with AP himself... and he can openly tell you all the details you want about the AP kit. problem here I see is that owners of the AP kit need to stand up and clear up these issues before someone who does not even OWN the kit starts spreading their "opinons about it" if the AP kit's thighs have been modded, then ask the maker?

wouldn't it be great if LFL put out a great new set of armor.. and it actually would have all 3 original trilogy variations and then they'd do clones? and then dorothy would finally get to the end of the rainbow and the tin man and the lion would... oh... wait.. I drifted off there for a second... we all know how it's been in the past... someday we'll be talking about the differences between TM and the new armor coming out. we can always dream the impossible dream... would really be interesting if the inside of the helmet is shown and the uniform of the trooper when he's not in armor. now those are interesting additions to the lore... live action television... "Lucas has stated that the series will not feature Darth Vader, Palpatine, or any Jedi characters, stating that "The Emperor and Darth Vader are heard about — people talk about them — but you never see them because it doesn't take place where they actually are. There are storm troopers and all that, but there are no Jedis quoted from wookiepedia" this is going to really update our events calendar that's what's fun about this hobby. and what happens to us when the live action series comes out? and then perhaps we'll be seeing a lot more events to troop at. and some troopers will say... hey... nice ATA kit... or hey... nice SDS kit... does anyone out there have an AP kit that they have used the overlap method on? would be cool to have closeups of all the arms and leg's parts.

my kit seems to be properly cut out, and assembled according to the ANH style in the Stuka advised method. I just don't think that if you cut it out on the lines that you need a modeling iron. if you cut it out smaller to fit a smaller person... then you'd get a different result. and also might need a modeling iron. there is a little bit of a confusion about which way to assemble a kit for AP. some prefer the overlap, which would be for a whole different type of assembly. while others use the more cut out way. but TM pretty well has cleared that up in earlier posts. I'm looking into putting the details back into the tops of the thighs..

A completely modded MRCE looks pretty "hero" in a stylized way one for the hero version ANH... especially with filed teeth, and modded ears. THE AP helmet for the ESB stunt version. so actually the "accuracy" is just about as speculative as any other when it comes to what we have. so actually I have 2 helmets as of this point... yet soon I will have 3 and they're all going to be 2 AP and 1 modded MRCE... there are only 2 helmets out there that I know of that were ever cast... and star wars helmets pretty much covers the differences in helmet comparisons. I felt that it would make the imperfections stand out on the AP kit when they sit next to each other. it pretty much showcases the differences between styles. when the MRCE mod is finished it's going to be a completely new bucket. totally new ears, rubber, lenses, painted... with new decals. that's part of the fun of modding an MRCE... to get it to look right is fun. the AP ESB will be with mike's decals too... does anyone think I should make a chipped stunt AP ESB? or should I just make it a ESB hero... since it's ABS? and I'm a purchaser of TM's products... so the thread is there for people to look at and will be clearly showing the detailed differences in each set. I am most likely going to look directly into the black hole and instead of getting a SDS blackhole trooper... I'm probably going to GO TM. he's a little less costly than sds... but having a blackhole trooper by 2011 would be fun if anyone wants to look over at the shepperton site you'll see that he has "agents" who can purchase kits and send them out. the kit versions of the sds armor are really looking tempting?

I know a place where you can get a real folding stock for $50 it's from the MK4 sterling. not the mk3 like some are selling. PM me if you want the details.

I just purchased them... now on to the blaster! woo hoo... an ESB blaster looks like a bunch of fun. all I need is that, and my helmet stickers... and I'm GTG oh yeah... and a new belt from canada and a new canvas from somewhere. I have a chazz belt... I wonder how good another maker would be? might need one with a plastic insert. I'm most likely going to have to support my current ANH style with some plastic backing.

so it follows better form if I have drilled handplates to sew them on to silk gloves? those type of gloves would be shorter at the wrist, and have basically no pattern? cotton lycra sounds like a much more comfortable style. and silk might be just an assumption? now to find my ESB blaster? now that's going to be fun!

When I get done with the mods... and assemble my helmet in ESB style... I'll be posting my acceptance photos... might be a few more weeks... maybe longer. I'm waiting for some more ESB parts. and I need to mod my MRCE some more... ears, painting and decals for that. and the full ESB build on a belt and blaster. The blaster ESB 'may have section' is really cool. so far the TM handplates I have, and the neck and brow trim look incredible!

so I would sew them onto rubber gloves and I'd be GTG??? thanks for clearing this up! THT

I ordered these... they totally rock!!! paul is really good... I ordered them trimmed and drilled. AMAZING WORK!

what about the extra sets of armor that were produced for ESB? that might explain the missing trap on the back of that helmet? just a thought?

Looks like I'm gonna Iron Out some of that Ole Eye bump myself! since I'm not doing a stunt build. The MRCE looks pretty hero style modable to me... so that's where I went with that puppy.

information is the key to the process of complete understanding. my goal here is to have the discussion openly so that people can see my apparent lack of understanding, and gain some perspective on the whole situation. while stuka's tutorial is a great addition to the concepts of putting armor together, your photographic evidence leads me to want to mod the armor I personally have, to include elements like the tops of the thighs. not to mention the hook on the bicep, and other "hero" style modifications. so now I'm lead to want to mod my own kit, to properly show the details that you have corrected on the TM kit. it's going to be a lot of fun to get the proper form on the top's of my thigh parts with dare I say it?? "a modeling iron" oh no! I've become one with the 'dark side' and I really must say that without stuka's tutorials and without your knowledge and understanding I'd most likely still be pondering the exact method of assembly. I have no bee in my bonnet... I'm just a total armor fanatic... and I wanted to share my experience in this great hobby because I loved it when I was 17... and now I have it when I'm 48. I have to say my "hat's off to all of you..." oh and by the way paul... thanks for the great work on the parts I just purchased from you. I'm very happy with the results of my received parts. below is an excerpt from a letter PM I recently have: QUOTE I've been trying to research armor sets, and I've been leaning toward AP over TM. Do you know where I can find a good AP build other than stuka's to reference and compare before deciding? I'm not sure which side of the AP vs. TM debate your on, it kinda seems like your against both... do you have any suggestion for what I should do? (I'm sorry if this sounds bad - just trying to do more research before spending lots of money) /QUOTE Actually I'm for BOTH of them... the thread I've been posting in... is a result of purchasing the AP kit because I was told it was "cast from the originals" but from what I've seen by purchasing the kit... is that I've been misled on exactly how to assemble the arms, and leg parts. Stuka's tutorial, while interesting... is not the correct way to assemble it according to the maker. even though I'm done assembling the kit according to stuka's concepts, without the modeling iron... I've been doing research on exactly how to assemble the AP style kit, and will do my best to try to show in photos how to assemble the arms and legs according to the maker of the armor in question. Most likely AP will have to supply photos of the correct arm and leg photos. so far we have the forearms and biceps with some basic photographs. If you cut exactly on the cut lines enscribed in the AP kit you can get the overlap aspect of the kit to fit almost exact. the method of cutting out the armor is easy to describe but sometimes tough to do. first I scribe with a box cutter on the cut line 2x then I use a pair of regular pliars to bend and flex the cut line until it snaps. when following the cut lines you need to be smooth, firm and flowing in your cuts. take it slow, and don't work too quickly. start out by cutting out the AB plate, and back plates. move on to the legs and arms last... because you're going to need a bit of practice before you tackle the smaller more important parts. it's best to remember that if you cut it out a little larger... you can then sand it by hand to the correct shape and line. if you're really good at cutting, then sanding is just the finishing step. I would never use a dremel to cut out armor... far too easy to mess it up. if you're really not comfortable cutting freehand, you can always build up a few layers of black electrical tape for the blade to follow. just make sure that you scribe lightly at first then firmer on the 2nd pass. save all your trimmed parts and you can make some "armor repair paste" by dissolving the plastic in a small amount of evaporative solvent... acetone is a type to use, but you have to remember that it's toxic and prone to fire when wet. you get the paste to the proper consistency a little at a time, and you can keep it in a sealed glass container. I always use E6000 glue. and clamp with screw clamps... not spring clamps. this type of glue takes about 20 hours to set fully. you don't want any parts moving during the setting phase. I save all the trimmed parts in as large a shape as I can, so to use them for inside strips, and use the larger parts of the trimout for the side gap shims around the waist. I then use 60 grit sandpaper placed on a flat surface and rubb the armor across the paper until I get a perfectly straight line. shoulder bells for example... then I sand the edge so that it's round, and has no burrs. it's best to use screen captures and photos when trimming out the chest plate and the back plate. you don't want to model a return where there was none. the chest plate needs a lip across the bottom, but on the sides there is almost no return on the parts. you need to spend a lot of time looking at side view photos to get the feel for the proper amount of "return" to leave on the parts. especially on the back plate and chest plates where you're going to see those elements where you cut. basically I left about 3-5mm of angle on all the edges. on some of the parts you can still see a very faint line where I've left the cut lines barely intact. this aspect made me very happy with the result. a modeling iron, and such are not needed when you apply the proper torque, and with the overlap method you're going to get a lot stronger of a build than using the butt end method. I would Email both makers and get a price quote from them. Since TM is in england, and AP is in canada it's usually best to expect to pay for about 25 lbs for shipping. and you're gonna want that INSURED. AP: edited contact info out. TM: edited contact info out. I purchased the AP kit last year... and it cost me over $ total removed. un trimmed. with boots, blaster, belt and undersuit I'm guessing that my overall kit has cost about $ total removed I would purchase a resin blaster, and it's always good to purchase your own dyed through leather for a holster. Ca boots $80 (you might want to look into TKboots... some say those are better? ) blaster $75 (maker of things from ebay... really looks good! ) Belt $45 canvas, needed for EIB not supplied with kit. Stomper Hovies $30 ( I bought 2 sets, one for my MRCE and one for the AP helmet ) new rubber trim $20 ( incorrect trim supplied with kit ) green bubbled lenses from ebay $35 ESB stickers from mike $22 Undersuit $70 Leather, snaps and strapping, $45 it has taken me over a year to source the hardest parts especially the hovies and rubber parts... I have a holster pattern, and lot's of suggestions. let me know if you need any advice. I have purchased AP armor, and TM parts for my ESB build. I'm finally going to go for all 3 types of builds... ANH ESB and the expanded universe TX most likely I'll purchase a TX from paul if he'd offer me one... END OF letter... so I guess you can see that people really want the best advice... and that's why all of these posts are here... troopers helping troopers! by the way... I love my AP kit... and now that I'm going to model in the correct details as TM has clearly shown... I know I've done my best... and that's the happy part!

I think that star wars helmets does a great job of showcasing the differences, and history of the white armor. it looks like all you'd need to show in those photos would be the tops of the thigh without the drop boxes covering them up. in many many photos the tops cannot be seen. so it looks like if the AP kit were properly assembled all we'd get is the prop dept. version of the armor that THEY recast. so it looks like they started with an ANH set... and then they recast that for the ESB "extra sets" so if the set they cast from that series was even more changed by AP himself. then we can clearly see that there are lot's of details lost in this process. it looks to me like paul's TM kit is actually establishing lost details being recaptured by his sculpting work. much of the work being done by members of this forum is very very good. that's why I'm building armor kits by the great people here. this is not about me being right... it's more about my being wrong. and sometimes even the best tutorials are wrong. we should all take great care to transmit the correct information... I built my AP kit according to the assumption that the parts were trimmed to fit flush against each other. but if the proper way is to assemble it with an overlap... then I'm missing about 5mm of curves and differences in dimension... somthing I'd have to fix by completely starting over on the whole kit, to get the same results... not only is a return not needed on an AP kit's assembly but from what I'm reading from AP himself... we're supposed to overlap and then trim the finishing strip over that. AP owners should consider the overlap method of assembly as moulded into the design? it will be nice to find a AP tutorial with the overlap method.

www.starwarshelmets.com has a great section on helmets... The Armor section has been updated... looks like this might be the place to get most of the details everyone wants. and if SWH.com is correct... then ROTJ style troopers were produced DURING ESB's production. even see John mollow's notes about Plastic trim around edges... all from ESB production notes. I've even been told that I should use Green Flat lenses for an ESB helmet... but I clearly see all- Bubbled green lenses in ESB helmets. when I build up my ESB it's going to have the squared frown, and bubbled green lenses. oh... and by the way... I'm going to purchase them from E BAY actually getting parts from someone who uses more than a spoon and a heat gun... as has been suggested to me in the past. troopers helping troopers

well, from what I see on many of the build threads, and from the photos on site... many people Including myself are assembling the AP kit FAR FAR differently than it most likely should be. The Stuka tutorials show a butt end build, but the maker of AP armor himself seems to be showing an overlap method. part of the problem with all these different "build threads" is that some of the people honored for doing a great job of misleading some of us on exactly how to build up a kit. after looking around on this site there isn't really a single accurate build being praised as the "right" method. if there is an overlap tutorial then we should be directing people to THAT thread... not the stuka tutorials. if you cut like stuka, and he says that he cut it smaller to personally fit him. so a lot of people think that they have to use a modeling iron to finish up the AP kit. putting a "return" on parts that don't even need one according to what I see on screen. I mean really, can anyone see a return on the shins? can you? can anyone really see a return on the biceps? all of those 'returns' aren't even on ANH style armor. I left a return on the forearms because I wanted it to be a cross between ANH and ESB style trims. and a lot of people are being told incorrectly that they should butt end join... instead of overlap. so the purpose of this thread, and others... should be to gather the CORRECT information on EXACTLY how to properly build the kit. so we've got stuka, and panda trooper, and even me representing the incorrect method of assembling a kit. butted ends with an inner strip and finally the outer finishing strip. the overall purpose of a build thread would be to do it right! now we're telling almost everyone to look at Stuka's excellent work. but most likely that work is not correct for the 80% of AP builders out there! sometimes this site does it's job correctly, and sometimes the site shares slightly incorrect information. there are great examples of TM build threads, but there even is one example of a TM build where the person didn't keep the proper Return when cut out... so now this person has basically ruined their kit in some small way... partly because they didn't read correctly... partly because there is not always the best information out there. pushing other build threads to be isn't the answer... there should be a photographic comparison of all the kit's in current use... to help everyone choose the armor that's right for them. and Even if I'm wrong... and have been mis-informed... then this thread is doing a great job of letting people who don't know as much as you FBJ, and TM... I've even heard people that thought that AP legs are exactly the same pieces. and that's part of why I started this thread in the first place. each part of the legs, are different parts. none of the leg parts fit inside each other like the forearms, and biceps. pointing people to "just wade through" all of this information would be great, if all the information was correct. as you can see... even thinking that AP was from an ESB kit is not correct... and I've been talking, and reading, and looking at the INCORRECT information for building up a $1000 kit. and now... my kit is just OK. instead of "spot on" because I followed Stuka's method because I thought he was right. each time I test fitted the parts in the overlap, I was really tempted to just follow the overlap method... and now I know I should have read more, and perhaps even contacted AP and discussed it with him. but I trusted, and I was sadly mistaken... and I followed stuka pretty closely. so now I'm really tempted to get a TM TX kit... just to see it in BLACK. a photo workup with permission takes a bit of time the hobby needs a good central place for everyone to look at photos, and be properly directed to build up their kits by people using the correct methods.

well... this is all here for the benefit of the hobby itself. I'm kinda thinking that a flash application might be in order on a detailed basis to give fan's and newbies... and incorrectly informed people such as myself to see a really amazing and detailed comparison in a graphic format. it would do the hobby a great service to organize this effort. if you would PM me... I shall engage the details. paul, your work is being praised here, along with mark's... transparency and understanding is somthing everyone gains here. if it were not for the UKG where would we all be?

well... my goal here is to gather as much photographic comparison material as I can... and let all the photos be the proof. my understanding of the situation is obviously incorrect. perhaps there are other potential owners of armor out there who can benefit from the discussion. the purpose here is to gather as much as can be put together, and I'm thinking that it would be a good idea to put AA-sds TM AP and screen capture/promo shots all together, part by part and let the details and differences show. like a series of overlays on top of each other... transparent overlays if the angle's are correct enough. I have permission from one TM owner so far and I'm interested to gather some AP shots. When I look at some of the information that mark put up, I can see that the method of assembly differs quite a bit from STUKA's tutorials... AP is using the overlap method of assembly... and that makes it look quite a bit different than I assembled my kit. The only way I could duplicate the top of the thigh from the photos presented would be to have a different method of assembly, and I'd have to sculpt it and trim it, and use the dreaded modeling iron! I have AA-SDS shots, and could get some more. never knew that the bucks were changed... that's kinda weird... why would someone change it? if they had the 'real' thing? shows how much information can be had, by asking the right people? Looks like I'll have to Mod my Ap Thighs. and add the Hook on the biceps for the shoulder bell elastic.

PM sent.

This Thread is so interesting AP owners might need to fill out this form: -------------- Very Interesting photographic work!