Helmet Assembly Mishap- help!

[EmlanThane]

I am in a combination of both sadness and panic. There's an issue that appeared when I began to assembly my helmet... the back/cap and faceplate didn't fit together very well AT ALL.

I did post about this on my build thread (which you can follow here: http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/topic/38064-emmas-first-anh-stunt-wtf-any-help-is-appreciated/#entry509345  ) but I am re-posting my problem here in the hopes that more people who are willing to help can lend me a hand. I really want to try to save this before I have to put more money into new pieces. Here's what I posted on my thread:

 

 

_______________________________

 

Ok, so day two is over and I think I hit a very large bump in the road. In my excitement I fear I may have trimmed TOO much- which is the worst thing one can do, especially on the helmet.

 

***IMPORTANT QUESTION***

 

Please take a look at my pictures below. Is the helmet salvageable? The pieces just aren't aligning properly, and the faceplate seems very short on the sides. The back doesn't reach down far enough. I'm pretty upset. The worst thing that can happen is I reluctantly spend more money on replacement pieces. The best thing that can happen is you all help me figure out how to fix it, but it still looks more "unique."

 

My day started out pretty ordinary- I cut out the eyes with an exacto knife and filed them down-

 

Still could use a little fine-tuning, that's ok

 

 

Then I began trimming the back and cap- again started out pretty rough but I sanded it down..

As you can see I am still getting the hang of the dremel..

 

Then the scary part happened. I fit the pieces together, and well.... you'll see  

 

 

Looks okayish here..

 

AHHHHH whAT IS tHAT

 

 

 

AND it seems so smooshed- how can I fit my head in there? This is the best I could get it to align. Otherwise the back and cap and face place intersect at an angle so that the bottom is less flat and more a giant "U"

 

 

 

 

Please, any help is appreciated. I want to try to save this before investing in new pieces.

Edited July 17, 2016 by EmlanThane

[gmrhodes13[Staff]]

Don't panic yet .

 

Helmets are not made mirrored and they can sit differently on both sides, gap on one side and not on the other.

 

From your photos it does look like your faceplate could come upwards and also forward at the chin. Also the trim line on the front of the cap does not look straight, may need a trim so the brow trim sits a little higher, will allow the faceplate to come upwards.

 

I would advise using magnets to hold everything in place, not clamps through the eyes as that will push pieces apart.

 

Remember if you have any gaps on the sides the ears will cover these.

 

I found referencing others builds to be a great help

[EmlanThane]

Don't panic yet .

 

Helmets are not made mirrored and they can sit differently on both sides, gap on one side and not on the other.

 

From your photos it does look like your faceplate could come upwards and also forward at the chin. Also the trim line on the front of the cap does not look straight, may need a trim so the brow trim sits a little higher, will allow the faceplate to come upwards.

 

I would advise using magnets to hold everything in place, not clamps through the eyes as that will push pieces apart.

 

Remember if you have any gaps on the sides the ears will cover these.

 

I found referencing others builds to be a great help

I will try trimming the brow a little bit more to raise the faceplate up. Thank you for the advice. I am panicking slightly less now.  I have magnets to use so I will go grab those, too. The other problem is that I really can't pull the chin out more- when I trimmed it the other day I took away very little, but maybe it was still too much. Is the bottom of the cap ok? I also think that back-to-front isn't long enough, and like I said I think I trimmed to much already! I have been checking other people's builds a lot lately, I am noticing that their faceplates do come forward more than mine. Hmmm...

[magni[TK]]

Plus you looked a little heavy on the bottom of faceplate. When you're done the opening will still be egg shaped. You have to do the twist when putting the bucket on or crunch your nose.

[EmlanThane]

Plus you looked a little heavy on the bottom of faceplate. When you're done the opening will still be egg shaped. You have to do the twist when putting the bucket on or crunch your nose.

Heavy? I'm sorry I don't quite understand. Is there still more room for me to trim out under there?

[magni[TK]]

I'd wait till you have it put together with ears and all to see where it ends up. When your at that point check out the great helmet photos in the gallery. You'll see the egg shape and how much plastic is on the chin. Helmets are always tough. Take your time and you'll get there. This is just one of the hundred panic attacks you'll have. Ha We've all been there and we made, so will you future trooper.

 

Sent from my LGMS631 using Tapatalk

[pandatrooper[TK]]

Can you take a photo of the brow of the cap? It looks like you can trim it more.

[EmlanThane]

Can you take a photo of the brow of the cap? It looks like you can trim it more.

Hi Pandatrooper! Here are some pictures with and without the brow. Is this what you were looking for? I don't think I cut it very even, but if I cut the sides up until the traps then it will be straight and then maybe I can raise the faceplate up. What do you think? (The sides of the cap/back and faceplate don't have a lot of intersect room AT ALL btw, not relevant to this but certainly part of the problem- this is why I cannot really bring the chin forward anymore)

 

 

What do you recommend to use to trim a tight spot like this? My scissors are kinda clunky to maneuver this...

Edited July 18, 2016 by EmlanThane

[EmlanThane]

OKAY! So, I've been playing around with the fit of the pieces again. I trimmed the brow a little bit more even, but I will have to trim it back on the sides and possibly higher altogether to make this work. I've decided to not trim the bottom until assembly is complete. That way I don't have to worry about lining up the bottom at this stage. 

 

As you can see below, I can trim out the bottom of the faceplate once the ears are on to make the s-trim line up nicely. For now it still looks pretty ugly but otherwise the brow would have to sit even lower, which isn't really possible.

 

Here's the other side (the problem side). The helmet looks pretty stubby back-to-front but it's the best I can do with how I trimmed the faceplate sides. The gap between the pieces is very hard to push down, and I'm not even sure if the ears can push the seam flat. I might have to use heat. argh.

Above I think I can trim the side so that that bottom corner won't peak out in front of the ear once I put it there. The bottom of the back I can definitely trim to get rid of that straight part running along the bottom and making the bottom angle more than it should be. There is a small gap from the angle I've created, too. If the ear doesn't cover this I can use abs paste. If the ear does cover it, depending on where the bottom screw is I may need to add an extra bit of abs with glue for the screw to go to (or not if it's stable enough).

 

For comparison, here are the sides of my helmet next to another almost-completed WTF helmet that I recently acquired.

 

I think the faceplate is crooked side-to-side, I need to fix that, too. It's hard because there is minimal overlap on the left.

 

Here's an example of where an ear would go on the "trouble side." As you can see, it sits pretty close to the front, and there isn't much room for the stripes.

 

 

Can anyone help me figure out if this is the best configuration I can get out of this and if I can go ahead and continue on to the next step, or if I should continue playing around with it? I can add the rubber brow and see how it looks. The helmet will definitely be more "smooshed" but it will still fit since the other one it's being compared to could be worn with my giant ponytail.

Edited July 31, 2016 by EmlanThane

[pandatrooper[TK]]

Firstly, I still think you can trim that brow. Looking at your more recent pics, it still looks low to me. 

Take a look at my old helmet build. I used a straight strip of plastic to draw a pencil line. The trim line in my build is aligned with the rear ridge separating the dome and back.

http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/topic/14806-how-to-assembling-ata-abs-helmet-1/

Take a look at where I've drawn the black lines. In particular the height of the brow and where I cut off some of the "lumpiness" of the area around the ears and cheek tubes. I can see a few bumps where the back isn't sitting flush. You don't need any of the irregularities in that area because the ear covers it anyways. Of course, draw some pencil lines where you intend to trim and place the ear on top to double check first.

Also, it looks like the clamps you're using through the eye openings are pushing things askew. I would suggest using small mini bar clamps since they offer a lot more clearance. Or consider using rare earth magnets.

https://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-5462-Quick-grip-2-6-Inch-Clamps/dp/B00004YOBR

Hope that helps.

[EmlanThane]

Firstly, I still think you can trim that brow. Looking at your more recent pics, it still looks low to me. 

 

Take a look at my old helmet build. I used a straight strip of plastic to draw a pencil line. The trim line in my build is aligned with the rear ridge separating the dome and back.

http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/topic/14806-how-to-assembling-ata-abs-helmet-1/

 

Take a look at where I've drawn the black lines. In particular the height of the brow and where I cut off some of the "lumpiness" of the area around the ears and cheek tubes. I can see a few bumps where the back isn't sitting flush. You don't need any of the irregularities in that area because the ear covers it anyways. Of course, draw some pencil lines where you intend to trim and place the ear on top to double check first.

 

Also, it looks like the clamps you're using through the eye openings are pushing things askew. I would suggest using small mini bar clamps since they offer a lot more clearance. Or consider using rare earth magnets.

 

https://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-5462-Quick-grip-2-6-Inch-Clamps/dp/B00004YOBR

 

Hope that helps.

It definitely does. I've drawn some lines where I SHOULD trim, but I don't want to cut until I can get the green light that it's okay. 

 

I used a tape measure and some magnets to try to draw a straight line across. Have I trimmed high enough yet? I also thought about cleaning up the bottom.

 

Here's the right side:

The left side (which might even be able to be trimmed higher than where I marked! Right?). I added some red lines digitally indicating another place where I could trim up to. I don't know which one though...

 

Here's the front I can raise up. Is it straight? My original cut was not, so I think where the pencil line is now may be better.

 

And here's the bottom. Part of me wants to wait to trim it until assembly, where I can trim the entire bottom- faceplate included- at once to make it even. For now it looks ugly.. Sorry that the pencil line is so faint- I hope you can see it!

 

 

I am doing this and not cutting yet because I want to be careful. Do you think where I marked is good to cut, or is there another way? Thank you for helping me 

[pandatrooper[TK]]

Trim to your pencil lines. The red ones are a bit too much.

[EmlanThane]

Ok, so I have an update on helmet assembly. I am about ready to rivet everything together, but I would really like a thumbs up before I do so, since I still have a few questions.

 

Because of how I trimmed the faceplate, there is very little overlap between pieces on the sides. Once I rivet, I plan on gluing plastic bridges along the insides to back the cheek tubes. this might prevent tearing and will give me an easier time when screwing in the ears. What do you think?

 

Here is the "problem side."

 

I call it that for two reasons. One, this is what the bottom looks like. I am told that the ear will cover up  this oddly-angled junction.

 

I have already brought the faceplate up as much as I would like, so this is what I have.

 

Problem two, even when I push the sides together as hard as I can, there is this gap here. I was also told the ears may cover it up? Or I could use caulk?

 

Here's the better side.

 

Lastly here is the helmet compared to the already-assembled one.

 

The better side:

The problem side:

YES I KNOW the helmet looked funny because resting naturally I couldn't pull the faceplate out all the way, so this picture isn't completely accurate. If I pull it out more there will be minimal overlap so that is where the plastic bridge comes in handy.

 

So, what do you think? Is this the best I can do? 

[Troopacoola[TK]]

Hi, first off I think it looks fine, the pic with you holding the problem side will be fine in my opinion. I had a the same kind of gap and the ear did cover that, so no need for caulk IMHO. Secondly, if the ear bolts look like they will go through both the front and back pieces then I don't think you need to put a plate inside.

 

 

Marc

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=61082

 

http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/index.php?/topic/38021-CTID's-RWA-ANH-Stunt-WIP......-501st-Here-we-go!

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60937

[EmlanThane]

Hi, first off I think it looks fine, the pic with you holding the problem side will be fine in my opinion. I had a the same kind of gap and the ear did cover that, so no need for caulk IMHO. Secondly, if the ear bolts look like they will go through both the front and back pieces then I don't think you need to put a plate inside.

 

 

Marc

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=61082

 

http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/index.php?/topic/38021-CTID's-RWA-ANH-Stunt-WIP......-501st-Here-we-go!

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60937

Thank you for your feedback. But I think the ear screws may not go through both, or may go through both but eliminate any overlap at that point by going directly between them (does that make sense? Maybe I should draw a picture.) Like hole-puching a piece of paper too close to the edge.

[Troopacoola[TK]]

Thank you for your feedback. But I think the ear screws may not go through both, or may go through both but eliminate any overlap at that point by going directly between them (does that make sense? Maybe I should draw a picture.) Like hole-puching a piece of paper too close to the edge.

I see what you mean. In that case then it may be worth going down the plate route.

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=61082

 

http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/index.php?/topic/38021-CTID's-RWA-ANH-Stunt-WIP......-501st-Here-we-go!

 

http://www.ukgarrison.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60937

[pandatrooper[TK]]

Here's what you need to do.

First, trim the right side of the helmet along the red line in the top photo. You've got a return edge that is preventing a tighter connection between the back and the face plate.



Second, pull the chin forward, so that BARELY any of the corner (where the green dot is) is overlapping the lower cheek tube on the face plate. See lower photo.

You may see a gap develop (which I mocked up in the lower photo) because sometimes the face plate / cap and back isn't formed deep enough or it's trimmed a bit short. Don't worry about this gap.

Install one of the ear rivets first. Go back to my build thread, you'll see that step. This allows you to hinge the face forward or back.

On the right side corner where the green dot is, just "grow a pair" and drill a hole through both parts on that corner that barely overlaps. Pop a 1/8" rivet and backing washer through it. If necessary, sometimes I have had to glue or using the same rivet, extended that area a bit lower so that there's some plastic real estate for the lower ear bolt to go through.

Don't worry about the gap between the cap and face where the ear goes. The ear covers it, and you haven't assembled the helmet yet. Once you put rivets and the bolts through, it will tighten things up.

I've had to do this on several helmets. No one sees the inside edge as the rubber trim covers any shimming you might need to do.

*BTW: I still think your brow is a bit low, it could be angled and trimmed higher but that's up to you.

[EmlanThane]

Alright, I finally got around to trimming that side, but I still would feel better getting a thumbs-up before I actually rivet things together. Does anyone know of a good video source of how to back a rivet with a washer? I would like to do that but can't figure it out!

 

Here's the left side:

 

 

My biggest concern is if the face looks to flat and isn't pulled out enough. The brow already sits pretty low. Should I bring it up so it looks more like a stunt and not a hero?

 

And the right. Is it a little better? A little? Maybe?

 

Again, still looks slightly flat. Could there be even less overlap? Did I cut the curve to steep and it should be even straighter? So many questions 

 

Please let me know what you all think   Thank you!