EU armor? Based upon which armor build?

[HeloTrooper]

Upon looking over the CRLs for the EU Troopers, it seems as though there is no definitive answer about which armor configuration (ANH, ESB, ROTJ) they are based on. The pictures included with the CRLs lean towards ANH, but the text does not narrow the requirments down to that level of detail.

 

Some EU Trooper configurations could be derived from the time of the particular appearance in the story line - but I'm asking if there is an established accepted basis for these costumes.

 

Thanks for the help!

[Locitus[Admin]]

Most EU armour is based on ROTJ armour with an ANH helmet.

[TK Keith[TK]]

Great question! I have read a ton of the EU books but never really thought about the style armor the stormtroopers wore.

[ObiHahn[TK]]

Since most EU trooper stuff is a bunch of wild and colourful fantasy stuff anyways, does it really matter?

 

Hardly any comic artist takes the time to specify on ANH/ESB/ROTJ armour, no toy or statue maker gets the details right as of now, and game renders are all over the place as well.

 

When it's armour not based on a movie, don't bother trying to match it to a specific movie style armour. Just my humble opinion. But I am not a fan of EU skittles troopers anyways, so...

[Locitus[Admin]]

I should clarify that I was talking about the video game armours, which we in the CRL have (more or less) defined as ROTJ armour with ANH helmets and paint jobs. What they look like in the comics I don't know or care much about.

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Mathias is correct. The TKC & ICN also have ANH hand guards as well, whereas the SKY has ROTJ ones. We usually don't use comic books as a source for the reasons cited.

[HeloTrooper]

Thanks to everyone for their comments.

 

It sounds like any generally acceptable 'style' armor would be agreeable (meaning approvable) as the basis for an EU Trooper, so long as the obvious respects are paid to clear and distinct characteristics.

 

Safe Troopin'!

[ObiHahn[TK]]

I was referring to the fact that I feel calling most video game renders "mainly ROTJ" is a very very loose interpretation, considering how sloppy and all over the place video game stormtroopers are.

 

It's just a decision made by FISD and Legion to agree on ROTJ based armour for the whole Skittles EU trooper mess, that's what I am saying - a true and 100% accurate version of any video game trooper would require a whole new sculpt for each individual version, based on the actual 3D renders.

To be honest, calling them "definitely ROTJ" or the like is just a "close enough" situation - and I am not criticising or nitpicking, just observing.

 

At best, they all show certain superficial signs of some ROTJ details here or ANH details there (like the Hasbro figures) but are, in the end, just an amalgamation of what the general public thinks "a stormtrooper" looks like, ignoring all subtle tells of the different movie stormtrooper versions established in our community.

 

Take screen derived ANH trooper armour, add some white edge trim, flip the abdomen button plates, paint the whole shebang blue in places and voilá: your "blue TK commander" looks just as much "ROTJ" as does the in-game model...

[Locitus[Admin]]

Pretty much every stormtrooper rendition post ROTJ theatre release has had tells similar to that specific look, very much like how most Boba Fett renditions are modeled on either ROTJ or ROTJ SE.

[ObiHahn[TK]]

If by those tells you mean "slap on reversed ab buttons, edge trim and bubble lenses", I agree - I read somewhere that Lucasfilm considers the ROTJ stormtrooper to be the definitive version (shame...).

 

But other than those small similarities between EU and ROTJ TKs, I have yet to see a game render or any non-photo based material true to any movie version.

Mostly it's all shoddy interpretation of the general concept "stormtrooper".

 

But sorry, I digressed a bit. I'm just not a fan of the common community opinion that flashy EU trooper stuff resembles what I feel are stormtroopers as seen in the movies.

 

I've been scratching my head for quite some time why all that expanded fantasy stuff has no own detachment, like they do for the Sith Lords (1 detachment for movie style, and then the whole other "Darth Whatevers" in another detachment).

Isn't Spec Ops the place for the EU stuff, where the Shadow Trooper found a home? I never understood the reasoning behind putting a black TK in another detachment, but including the rainbow brigades in FISD. They are just as different from a real TK like the black version is, no?

Why can't FISD just be what MEPD is for sandtroopers... just the movie versions of the TK?

Explanation, gentlemen?

[Locitus[Admin]]

Some video game renditions of what a stormtrooper ends up looking like are limitations of the hardware it's rendered on, and doesn't fully represent the intended design, although those are probably based on ROTJ anyway. I too remember reading somewhere that LFL is considering the ROTJ look to be the "correct" one.

 

As for the latter question, regardarding the detachments - I have no idea. I'll have to leave that to Daetrin to answer.

[ObiHahn[TK]]

As for the latter question, regardarding the detachments - I have no idea. I'll have to leave that to Daetrin to answer.

 

That really interests me, and I hope I am not derailing this topic too much.

Was that just a coincidental development or is there a thought process behind excluding one and including another variant of the same costume in this detachment?

 

So many examples pop into my head:

- The HWT is basically a clean, not very well observed sandtrooper, so why not put him with the MEPD? Right, because the MEPD focuses on movie versions only.

- Paint the entire costume black and it is Spec Ops, but make it partially red, blue, grey and all that and it is still considered a FISD TK?

- Why decide on mainly ROTJ for CRLs when it's basically just edge trim and ab buttons but the prominent khaki chipped ANH helmet plus ANH handguards are just as obvious an inspiration for most game renders?

- Aren't video game graphics limitations just as valid a reason for adapting CRLs like movie costume amendments are? (I am not actually saying that someone needs to re-sculpt or 3D print those shoddy renders for a truly accurate game representation costume but you get my point.)

 

Those are just some of the thoughts that have me scratching my head. That, and me being a movie TK purist.

 

Daetrin, are you willing to shed some light on this?

Edited July 13, 2012 by ObiHahn

[Daetrin[Admin]]

The answer to why they are here is because in the end they are base clean white TK's, and we're a TK detachment. You may not like them, but others in the Legion do. In fact there are more TKC's than ROTJ Legion-wide.

 

It's a waste and duplication of effort to take the same costume - paint excepted - and create a whole new detachment on it. It would be like plain white clones creating their own detachment. The duplication of information in armor building, assembly, etc. is non-trivial. Heck, FISD almost absorbed MEPD at one point, as there are fewer differences between a sandtrooper & ANH stormtrooper than an ANH stunt & ROTJ.

 

If you look at MEPD - what information is there really? Nearly nothing on building armor, as all that information is here. In the end - hiding out in your little corner of the world just shrinks it.

 

If a Legion member is really passionate about clean TK's (and I'm one such person) then instead of retreating to their own space (as people told me I should do), I instead take that passion to as many people as I can, because what's cooler than a clean TK? A whole squad of TKs! And what's cooler than a squad of TK's? 100 TK's marching together, that's what.

 

This is why we created the EI and later the Centurion programs, and why we slave relentlessly on a newsletter - to help the Legion slowly but inexorably up the standards of our craft and open the possibility of what can be.

 

The reality is that the numbers of TK's in the Legion in decreasing, and the only way we're going to reverse this is to evangelize what we know and make it easier for other Legion members to get in to outstanding TK's.

 

Does this make sense?

[ObiHahn[TK]]

Does this make sense?

 

It sure does in a way, and thanks for taking the time for a detailed reply like that, Paul.

 

I see where you are coming from, but still do not see why the Shadow/Blackhole stormies are not yet (or no longer?) part of this detachment.

And building on this, I thought it made sense to question the decision to consider all the other "non all white" variants more of a stormtrooper than the historically way older EU concept of black TKs,

instead of just:

a) putting absolutely all TK based variants in one detachment

or

establish a new more consistent separation between, say: all movie style TKs and all EU TKs in all the colours of the rainbow plus black.

 

It works for the Sith lords.

 

But it was just a thought anyways.

[HeloTrooper]

Thank you all for your comments. I'm glad I asked...