omp_uk

Do you mean the pic of Vader with the two ST's and the red background? If so, the thing that troubles me about that pic is that the trooper on the right has grey teeth. All the Empire ones on screen and those I've seen in on-set publicity stills were black. Is there a possibility this is a ANH hero (I know it has 4 teeth each side, but did every hero only have 3 teeth)?

If there are slight differences on the outside, could they be caused by use of the haircell ABS rather than the smooth ABS? I don't know how differently the materials would behave when being vac formed. David

Whilst I tend to agree with this statement, how do we know it is a fact? I still think that there was one mold for the face and backplate - when you have these things side by side it's hard to spot differences (with the exception of maybe the ears, which I'll look more closely at next time). There are also the matching tells inside the helmet. Next time I see the helmets I'll take measurements so we can move the discussion along. As for the comment about colour - every helmet I have seen (maybe 12 originals in person) has been a slightly different colour shade due to weathering, UV damage, ageing etc.

Joe, I'd certainly be interested to hear about how the molds differ (PM or email if you like). I'm only going on what I've seen in person, which in the last week is four original helmets, two haircell Empire (?) / Jedi and two US Jedi style. Two originate from the UK and two from the US. The same mold was definitely used for all four - there are very minor flaws on the inside of the helmet that match up in exactly the same spot in all of them. I am very open minded to the possibility of there being additional molds but the evidence points against it at the moment. Hopefully we can crack this one! David

Thanks for the link to the helmet - I have seen that one in person, it's a US Jedi helmet with a liner.

Joe, As far as I can tell there are two molds identified so far - the original for ANH and one made later - either during Empire or during Jedi. At this point I have not seen evidence of any additional molds being used. Is the helmet you pictured made from haircell (which one is it, I may have seen it in person)? Yes, it makes sense and I agree that if there were new helmets made for Empire then, based on the information available at the moment, the same mold was used for the Jedi helmets. I may be able to add more to this later in the week ;-) David

Some more fuel to the fire..... I got to compare an original Jedi helmet directly next to one of the haircell Empire (?) / Jedi helmets in the last couple of days and can confirm that they are definitely from the same mold. There are some minor irregularities on the interior of the helmet that match 100%. Sadly no pics as the owners didn't want any taken. So, the haircell helmets differ in terms of construction in every way to the Jedi helmets, aside from the mold. So, were these a second batch of helmets made for the UK Jedi scenes, or were they made for Empire then reused in Jedi? The David Oliver helmet came from a Jedi extra, so it would seem that the haircell helmets were def used in some capacity for Jedi. Confusing!

These are the Sci-Fi museum pieces? If so they should have the ESB Vader helmet there as well....

Another way to try and sort this out is to find someone with Empire contact sheets and see if any of the Jedi / Empire helmets are pictured there. I know someone with access to some Jedi contact sheets and they can't see the Jedi / Empire foam interior style of helmet pictured. I do know someone with some Empire contact sheets but they're pretty inaccessible - I may be able to get them in a couple of months.....maybe not!

Yep, same author and due out in March next year.... http://www.amazon.com/Making-Star-Wars-Epi...1829&sr=8-1

Hi Joe, No, these were two completely different helmets..... David

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum but have been collecting original props for 9 years and have been fortunate enough to see and handle a number of original Star Wars props, including helmets. Today I was able to compare a film used Jedi helmet (with strap / hard hat interior) directly against one of the Jedi (Empire ?) helmets that has the foam padding interior. For the purpose of this I'll call the Jedi helmet with strap interior 'Jedi' and the other 'foam'. These are the main differences... 1) Brow trim on 'Jedi' is taller by a noticeable margin (3 mm or more). 2) Mic tips on 'Jedi' are aluminium. Mic tips on 'foam' are resin. 3) Mic tips on 'Jedi' are smooth around the circumference. Mic tips on 'foam' have a number of raised ridges running along the length. 4) Ends of black teeth paint on 'Jedi' are rounded and finish about 1 cm after final tooth. Paint on 'foam' runs further down the helmet and is squared off. 5) Plastic interior of 'Jedi' is smooth to the touch, interior of 'foam' is an orange peel texture. 6) Jaw sticker stripe on 'Jedi has a margin around the edge and is a dark blue. Sticker on 'foam' is cut to the size of the stripe and the stripes are a lighter blue (I don't think this is a result of fading). 7) Interior construction differs - obviously one has a hard hat lining system, the other a foam pad. 8) Although the helmets appeared to be from the same mold, the crease that runs around the rear top of the helmet may be a little 'softer' (slightly less pronounced) on the 'foam' helmet. In my opinion we are dealing with two different runs of helmets. There is the possibility that they were on the same production line but they had a mish-mash of components from which to make them. The difference in paint length along the teeth could be down to one guy painting them slightly different to the other people that were painting them. Who knows. It would be interesting to try and find someone involved with the construction of the Jedi helmets so that we can gain more of an insight. Regards, David