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CableGuy

Early 2019 CRL update change requests

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How so?  You can't un-earn a award.  Once you get it, you have it forever, even if you sell the suit.

I didn’t relate it to an award for me - I wanted to troop with Centurion approved armour. I wear the Centurion badge with pride and maintain this standard whenever I troop.

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So do we have a general consensus regarding CRL updates? 

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17 minutes ago, ukswrath said:

So do we have a general consensus regarding CRL updates? 

I think this got a liiiiiittle off topic in a few areas, lol, but I was wondering the same thing.  Any final decisions?

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So do we have a general consensus regarding CRL updates? 



The consensus is yes to some changes that don’t change things unless you want to change those things and then your free to change what you think needs to be changed cause everything changes and change is good.....

But let’s not forget a no to changing those things that don’t need changing cause they’re ok not to change and change would be bad for those things....




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34 minutes ago, ukswrath said:

So do we have a general consensus regarding CRL updates? 

 

12 minutes ago, justjoseph63 said:

I think this got a liiiiiittle off topic in a few areas, lol, but I was wondering the same thing.  Any final decisions?

You guys just had to poke the hornet’s nest now did you:smiley-sw013: But is’s great to have passion:)

 

I’m on board for the changes suggested:salute:

 

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1 minute ago, StrmTRPR85 said:

can we get a quick one post recap on the proposed changes?

Do it:duim:

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can we get a quick one post recap on the proposed changes?

What, you don’t want to read a 300-page document on brow height, prop replication, and Viking origins? Shame on you!


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44 minutes ago, ukswrath said:

So do we have a general consensus regarding CRL updates? 

 

21 minutes ago, justjoseph63 said:

I think this got a liiiiiittle off topic in a few areas, lol, but I was wondering the same thing.  Any final decisions?

 

LOL - just a tad!! :laugh1:

 

On 1/1/2019 at 10:15 AM, justjoseph63 said:

In order to eliminate any ambiguity and make things clearer for those headed for Centurion, I am proposing the following changes to the CRLs for ANH Stunt and ANH Hero for level 3.  I realize that there were small variations in the films, but I believe these follow the general overall look.


 

 

Here's my thoughts on what Joseph raised;

 

1.  Ears shall be tilted back at an angle to where the screws align closely with the rear angle of the trap located above the rear of the brow.

 

Agree that this should be adopted as a "suggestion" (not a requirement) from day one, as I can't see many wanting to change them after basic and EIB. If the helmet can allow for this, why not aim for it from the start. Personally, I think this should be a suggestion only, not actually in the requirements.

 

2.  Tube stripes are positioned no more than approximately 7/16ths (1 cm) from the cheek, (a standard pencil width).

 

Agreed - "highly suggested" for L3.

 

3.  Top section of posterior armor shall be in line with the bottom portion of the kidney plate.

 

I would have thought this was a given, and we would highly suggest this at L3 anyway.

 

4.  Posterior snaps/cod rivet shall not be painted.

 

Agreed - requirement for L3

 

5.  Minimal (or no) gap is permitted between the  top of the shoulder bell and the shoulder bridge.

 

Difficult due to the various shoulder bell sizes and various personal size and shapes. Use of the word "ideally" would sit nicely here. 

 

6.  All abdomen buttons are integrated and painted directly on the armor.  No separate/added buttons are permitted.

 

Agree - required for L3

 

7.  D-ring on end cap shall be of a similar shape/size to the original Sterling type.

 

Agreed - required for L3 (if we can enforce a blaster requirement)

 

8.  3D printed weapons must be free of noticeable print lines.

 

Agreed - requirement for L3

 

 

Regarding Stunt brows, I think the images provided speak for themselves. 

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Jokes aside- my brief thoughts- yes, of course Centurion can be made more difficult to earn. Obviously you can keep adding specifics and get so overly-detailed if you wanted, but that doesn’t mean you should. I think the “suggested” language some proposed was a good idea. You want the majority of the TKs to be as close to one another as possible, but don’t want to discourage people from reaching a Centurion build.

I think adding a 5mm brow height and the whole tube stripe thing works. I think you should strongly suggest the ear angle, but shouldn’t force it.


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14 minutes ago, CableGuy said:

 

 

 

LOL - just a tad!! :laugh1:

 

 

Here's my thoughts on what Joseph raised;

 

1.  Ideally, the ears shall be tilted back at an angle to where the screws align closely with the rear angle of the trap located above the rear of the brow.

 

Agree that this should be adopted as a "suggestion" (not a requirement) from day one, as I can't see many wanting to change them after basic and EIB. If the helmet can allow for this, why not aim for it from the start. Personally, I think this should be a suggestion only, not actually in the requirements.

 

2.  Tube stripes are positioned no more than approximately 7/16ths (1 cm) from the cheek, (a standard pencil width).

 

Agreed - "highly suggested" for L3.

 

3.  Top section of posterior armor shall be in line with the bottom portion of the kidney plate.

 

I would have thought this was a given, and we would highly suggest this at L3 anyway.  As you know, we see this a LOT!

 

4.  Posterior snaps/cod rivet shall not be painted.

 

Agreed - requirement for L3

 

5.  Ideally, a minimal (or no) gap is permitted between the  top of the shoulder bell and the shoulder bridge.

 

Difficult due to the various shoulder bell sizes and various personal size and shapes. Use of the word "ideally" would sit nicely here. 

 

6.  All abdomen buttons are integrated onto the ab-button panels directly on the armor  No separate/added buttons are permitted. 

 

Agree - required for L3

 

7.  D-ring on end cap shall be of a similar shape/size to the original Sterling type.

 

Agreed - required for L3 (if we can enforce a blaster requirement)  I don't see why we can't.  Blasters are required for levels 2 and 3, and are a part of the costume, so to speak.

 

8.  3D printed weapons must be free of noticeable print lines.

 

Agreed - requirement for L3

 

 

Regarding Stunt brows, I think the images provided speak for themselves. 

I edited/commented on a few.  Thanks for the input!

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I think for brow trim there the verbage should be "ideally a spacing" rather than an enforcement of a measurement

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OMG! hahahahaha I love this group :laugh1:

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I think for brow trim there the verbage should be "ideally a spacing" rather than an enforcement of a measurement



Agreed if the group is hell bent on doing this and it seems some people are we should stick to phrases like that. Anytime you put measurements in it gets too strict. I think it should be the same for tube stripes. It’s always been said pencil width, stripes are small and go on a small surface, I’ve got fat fingers, they landed where they landed. Why should one be kept from centurion due to fat fingers and bad paint skills.


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I concur with Joseph's comments on CableGuy's recap.

 

And yes, I think mention of the existence of correct brow spacing is good to have in the CRL, so people building know what to aim for.  Keep the "Ideally" language in there, but for someone trying to go it alone, and looking at the wrong helmet for "screen used inspiration" it sucks to get that wrong, when it's so simple to steer them in the right direction.  Then no one is excluded, but they have some proper guidance they don't have to dig for.

Edited by kman
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What about those elbow gaps?

You guys are ready to fight bit and nails for five small millimeters on brow height but don't give a nickel about 4 inches gap at elbows?!

Curious priorities in my opinion.

 

But yeah... body shapes and sizes..... convenient excuse.

 

How about this one then: disqualify "Master Replica" helmets for basic approval? Haha, nothing ventured, nothing gained!

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7 minutes ago, The5thHorseman said:

What about those elbow gaps?

You guys are ready to fight bit and nails for five small millimeters on brow height but don't give a nickel about 4 inches gap at elbows?!

Curious priorities in my opinion.

 

But yeah... body shapes and sizes..... convenient excuse.

 

How about this one then: disqualify "Master Replica" helmets for basic approval? Haha, nothing ventured, nothing gained!

 

The millimeter language was removed, in case you missed that.

 

Body shape and size is not a "convenient excuse".  But there was a discussion of adding something about it to another section, which could be added.

 

When was the last time someone actually tried to get approved with a Master Replica helmet?  Is this a real concern?

Edited by kman

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What about those elbow gaps?
You guys are ready to fight bit and nails for five small millimeters on brow height but don't give a nickel about 4 inches gap at elbows?!
Curious priorities in my opinion.
 
But yeah... body shapes and sizes..... convenient excuse.
 
How about this one then: disqualify "Master Replica" helmets for basic approval? Haha, nothing ventured, nothing gained!
Tbh, I think you have a point with highlighting basic approval. Surely this should be the focus, I mean, decal tube stripes, plastic hand guards etc. Let's start new members off on the right track, rather than asking for corrections down the line. This would bring clearance levels across garrisons closer together. No?

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Back to the tube stripes. Most of have seen a micrometer used to measure the split rivet distance but has anyone seen or has an actual measurement for the tube stripe distance? If so let's see it or we need to remove any numbers.

 

I with Germain on the elbows we really need some wordage there. 

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Tbh, I think you have a point with highlighting basic approval. Surely this should be the focus, I mean, decal tube stripes, plastic hand guards etc. Let's start new members off on the right track, rather than asking for corrections down the line. This would bring clearance levels across garrisons closer together. No?

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Indeed Marc. This has been suggested. Starting from BBB.


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Indeed Marc. This has been suggested. Starting from BBB.


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Needs to happen mate. Makes sense, there's too many wanting to clear that are no where near a standard, but then you get the basic crl argument. You know the standards the ukg have and as an armourer the basic leve canl become an area of contention. We want our guys to look the best. However, some just want the easiest route to 501st status endorses that.

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3 minutes ago, CTID said:

Needs to happen mate. Makes sense, there's too many wanting to clear that are no where near a standard, but then you get the basic crl argument. You know the standards the ukg have and as an armourer the basic leve canl become an area of contention. We want our guys to look the best. However, some just want the easiest route to 501st status endorses that.

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I have an issue with GMLs expecting Centurion level requirements at basic. I know other garrisons that have that problem and it's a bit disturbing. I believe it's unrealistic and takes away from those who just want to do charity work or have fun. There needs to be a balance, what that is is debatable. 

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I have an issue with GMLs expecting Centurion level requirements at basic. I know other garrisons that have that problem and it's a bit disturbing. I believe it's unrealistic and takes away from those who just want to do charity work or have fun. There needs to be a balance, what that is is debatable. 
Not talking centurion level Tony, but as I said above. Basic is VERY basic at the moment. There are troopers out there who will build to basic, and then be discouraged due to the extra work involved. I guess what I'm saying is that EIB standard should now be basic. Too many 501st garrisons out there clear on a basic level. Then you see other troopers copying their builds, which repeats a substandard build. I honestly believe that if basic was removed, then future builders would engage more with how closer they could get their kits than at the moment. Just my humble opinion, but think we are focussing on the wrong area atm

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25 minutes ago, ukswrath said:

I with Germain on the elbows we really need some wordage there. 

"ideally no elbow gap is preferred" seems logical to me which still allows those with gaps to apply,

 

I really would hate to see people being denied for higher level approval because of arm and shoulder gaps, not everyone has the perfect shape, I know I don't.

 

I already hear us being called "elitist" don't think we want "discriminatory" added as well.

 

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8 minutes ago, gmrhodes13 said:

 

"ideally no elbow gap is preferred" seems logical to me which still allows those with gaps to apply,

 

I really would hate to see people being denied for higher level approval because of arm and shoulder gaps, not everyone has the perfect shape, I know I don't.

 

I already hear us being called "elitist" don't think we want "discriminatory" added as well.

 

 

I concur, although I'm not sure that exact wording works.  Elbows are funny, and the armor is even stranger.  Perfect armor has a "gap", arguably, so I'd want to clarify exactly what is meant, here.  This is aimed at n00bs, not armor experts who know exactly what we're referring to when we say "elbow gap", and what we're NOT referring to.

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