The types of R1 Armor and where they are going

[The5thHorseman[TK]]

I think this Jedha Trooper should be assign to the MEPD.

In my opinion, it's obvious the propmakers wanted to create a sandtrooper costume. The fact it doesn't share the armor details with the original sandtroopers from ANH doesn't come in play to me, because those original sandtroopers were very early armors thrown together to start shooting asap. They don't share all the same details with the ANH stormtroopers only because those parts weren't ready at the time the sandtroopers armors were made. The propmakers from R1 clearly didn't have this problem. The basic R1 stormtooper armor was all ready and they logically started from it to create the sandtrooper variant.

 

Actually in my opinion, everything with a heavy backpack should go over the MEPD. HWT included.

Edited June 18, 2017 by The5thHorseman

[Dutchy[501st]]

@ukswrath,

 

I know that we also have TD's  without packs. I guess I have expressed myself a bit too plain on this one.

 

Well dirt is an important one but my approach and point of view is that I see troopers like the HWT as a deployed trooper, not specifically designed for one planet. As TD's are deployed as well I gave it some thought and felt like the HWT could become a part of the MEPD as well, regardless decisions( badly or not) made in the past.

 

The guy in the trooper transport, the dirty TK is as I say a TK. I do not see variations like these being added to the MEPD.

 

@Colin1138,

 

I don't have feathers so you're just fine...

I know, the SE TD was and isn't that popular, but don't all detachments have a less favoured armor?

Anyway, there has been resistance against everything that wasn't ANH for years, but I as the new DL realise that we do need to broaden our view as a detachment if we want to move forward.

[themaninthesuitcase[Admin]]

The way I see it is the 2 dirty and backpacked troopers both feel like TDs to me.  The exact specifics like the knee and ab buttons may differ but the fact they are on a dirty planet, covered in dirt, wearing a backpack says TD to me.  As said I expect the costume designers where going for sand trooopers from ANH not HWTs from a game.

 

The trooper in the transport, could go either way, but gut feel is FISD as it's just a TK on guard duty.

[Sly11[Admin]]

Popcorn, I'm loving this conversation and really wish I could add some value, to it other than what has already been said. Jedah is a sandy rocky Barron type of planet, just saying.

 

 

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[ukswrath[Staff]]

Yea not really sure where the line in the sand will be drawn. There may be unhappy peeps either way. As Dutchy stated in the end it's for the Empire anyways. 

[Dark PWF[Staff]]

Devil's (and TK) advocate here, and I am not by any means opposed to working with the other Detachments (especially for the betterment of the Legion), but that same guide that references Sandtroopers on Jedha also plainly indicates that the Kyber collection pack was worn by Stormtroopers and shows the Patrol pack or the "HWT looking pack" being worn by the ones referred to as Sandtroopers.

 

It was documented in discussion here at FISD back in December/January:  http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/topic/39955-jedha-sandtroopers/

[Colin1138[TK]]

Just to confuse matters further..the Kyber Pack trooper is also seen( albeit fleetingly) on the asteroid trading outpost at the start of the movie...so even though pack,pauldron and a non clean appearence are great indications of classing them as Sandies....does the fact they are deployed on non desert worlds or environments not dismiss them as such?

 

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[henselmonster]

Without wishing to ruffle feathers...MEPD(of which I am also a member) isn't exactly keen on housing the Spec Edition Sandie( for the uninitiated..its a repurposed ROTJ TK). If the Sandie det( or a significant portion of its membership) doesn't even want a bonafide actual Sandie variation...why do they want the R1 versions?!

 

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I would say the consensus of the members over at MEPD would love for someone to do a SE Sandtrooper. If i had the spare cash I would totally do it! There are some that are very....opinionated, at times in the MEPD. That is a minority. The demographic of the MEPD is changing, while we love to strive for accuracy lots of the newer members and older veterans would love to see the MEPD come back to life and to expand out our CRLs. We take pride in accuracy, and we love the history behind the ANH Sandtrooper. These comments are from years ago. I would be thrilled if the HWT was in the MEPD, I wish i was around back then to voice my opinion, but it is what it is. As part of the MEPD staff we just want to revitalize the detachment, get people excited about building packs and BFGs, we are still finding all sorts of new things about these 40 year old costumes and accessories. If you haven't been over there recently take a look at all the new stuff we are finding and get to know some of the newer members. We love talking about this stuff. Now back to digging through eBay for vintage seed trays for my pack. 

Edited June 15, 2017 by henselmonster

[allan1313[TK]]

I can see where both sides can lay claim. I don't have a TD but have visited over there many times. It does seem a little stale, but compared to FISD all the other detachments seem to move a bit slower.

 

After reading the discussion I have kind of changed my outlook. Some new blood and new costumes would give them a shot in the arm. If I have a vote I would sat the Jedha trooper w/ pack goes to MEPD and FISD her the other pack. This seems like the "fairest" option and could possibly build up the ranks of MEPD.

 

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[CrookKnight[TK]]

I can see where both sides can lay claim. I don't have a TD but have visited over there many times. It does seem a little stale, but compared to FISD all the other detachments seem to move a bit slower.

 

After reading the discussion I have kind of changed my outlook. Some new blood and new costumes would give them a shot in the arm. If I have a vote I would sat the Jedha trooper w/ pack goes to MEPD and FISD her the other pack. This seems like the "fairest" option and could possibly build up the ranks of MEPD.

 

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Not a bad idea at all.

 

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[LoveMonkey[501st]]

I can see where both sides can lay claim. I don't have a TD but have visited over there many times. It does seem a little stale, but compared to FISD all the other detachments seem to move a bit slower.

 

After reading the discussion I have kind of changed my outlook. Some new blood and new costumes would give them a shot in the arm. If I have a vote I would sat the Jedha trooper w/ pack goes to MEPD and FISD her the other pack. This seems like the "fairest" option and could possibly build up the ranks of MEPD.

 

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This to me seems to be the easiest way for both detachments to get some of the new Rogue One goodness.  I really think it could bolster the MEPD with some new costumes, much like the Shoretrooper at Pathfinders (not looking to stir up that debate here, just saying).  I also think the SE Sandtrooper could be a nice addition as well.  Of course, it's all moot until the LMO decides.

 

I can see where dutchy comes from though, in that we'd love to have all the pack troopers over at MEPD, but that's not going to happen realistically after all the love FISD has given the HWT.

 

I'm really looking forward to the decision being made so we can get some CRLs done.

[CrookKnight[TK]]

I like the idea of splitting it up between the two Legions.

 

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[Dutchy[501st]]

I can understand that the Kyber Crystal trooper at first might look like a TD, but now that I have given it some extra thought it's clear to me that this speciifc trooper would probably better fit within the ranks of the FISD.

The pack is more like a storage system for crystals IMO compared to the packs that the TD's have to support the life system of the trooper.

The HWT trooper has a more identical pack to a TD, hence my thoughts about this trooper belonging to the MEPD.

[DarthStevius[TK]]

Being one of the newer members over on the MEPD (and the Legion in general) I agree there is a very different level of involvement versus the FISD. I used both sites to get my kit up to spec. as I'm sure others have.<br>

However it grows everyday, literally, and I for one believe the current command team are encouaging this growth and development along with many of its members.<br><br>

Regardless of the historical decisions made, there should be some agreed logic in how characters are designated to detatchments that both units' command teams can agree on. <br>

I know its not that simple but maybe it's around weathering, or packs worn or not, the roles they play, or how the official books and merch designates them, there should be a better way than one detatchment deserving it more than another.<br>

I would love more costumes over at the MEPD (and I guaruntee they would get a lot of love) but it obviously needs to be on it's merits that are logical and right for the greater Legion.<br><br>

To that end, it feels like the Jedha troopers sandtroopers should be with the MEPD. My two cents anyway.

[Dark PWF[Staff]]

The biggest problem with using the official books and/or merchandise is that as tightly as LFL has managed to get the continuity across the different media, in many situations, the official books contradict themselves by use of language.  The Shoretrooper is a perfect example of this.  For every situation where they clearly define things (like the Kyber pack vs the Sandtrooper pack) there are four more that are Shoretrooper-like in nature.  

It just makes them very difficult to use as an "automatic" resource.  

Discussions between the leadership and members of the Detachments interested in drafting, adopting, and managing the CRLs is the best possibly avenue for definitive resolution, regardless of sources being cited or used to make the determination.

 

I'd say that we're on a good course here with this one.

[Dark PWF[Staff]]

The pack is more like a storage system for crystals IMO compared to the packs that the TD's have to support the life system of the trooper.

The HWT trooper has a more identical pack to a TD, hence my thoughts about this trooper belonging to the MEPD.

 

I think that this right here, is way more profound than a lot of people are going to give it credit for being, and really makes a strong argument for the distinction of what separates TDs from TKs.  

 

Thank you for this.  

 

For the duration of my time here, it (separation of TK vs TD) has been largely based upon (in my opinion) rhetoric.  Statements like "They think that just slapping a pack on a TK makes it a TD?  They can't measure up to what it takes to be a TD, better class of Soldier" or "So, they don't care to clean their armor?  That makes them a different class of character?" have been far too common and divisive.  They don't define anything outside of egos, and they don't present any answers to the questions or acknowledge the history behind the characters or the MEPD, both of which are worthy of the distinction and admiration that they have earned.

[daryldoak[TK]]

I actually think the detachment name "Mos Eisley Police Department" maybe needs to be changed before adding new costumes.

 

I understand it made sense in 2005, but with all the new Star Wars movies, games, etc. it's now too narrow a definition to include these new trooper types.

Edited June 16, 2017 by daryldoak

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Just a quick note to say that I appreciate everyone's being civil in this discussion. I sense a lot of passion on the topic and appreciate that people both feel free to share their thoughts & feelings, and the mutual respect for each other's viewpoints.

[Dark PWF[Staff]]

I actually think the detachment name "Mos Eisley Police Department" maybe needs to be changed before adding new costumes.

 

I understand it made sense in 2005, but with all the new Star Wars movies, games, etc. it's now too narrow a definition to include these new trooper types.

The same argument was pitched about the FISD just a couple of years ago when The Force Awakens gave us The First Order Stormtrooper instead of the Imperial Stormtrooper.

 

The history and traditions of the Legion and the Saga itself were cited specifically when choosing not to pursue a change in name for this Detachment.

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Yeah, and you have Flagship Eclipse too. Pathfinders URL is BikerScout.Net. Those things will never change. MEPD will ever be MEPD...

[starsaber25[Admin]]

I can see where both sides can lay claim. I don't have a TD but have visited over there many times. It does seem a little stale, but compared to FISD all the other detachments seem to move a bit slower.

After reading the discussion I have kind of changed my outlook. Some new blood and new costumes would give them a shot in the arm. If I have a vote I would sat the Jedha trooper w/ pack goes to MEPD and FISD her the other pack. This seems like the "fairest" option and could possibly build up the ranks of MEPD.

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So after finally catching up on this thread, I couldn't agree more with my pal Allan. We are all one legion. This Jedha trooper has similarities to the Sandtrooper and if the MEPD feels that this fits under their umbrella and it would boost their membership then I would be supportive of it. If you are a member of the FISD and never built a TD to become a member of their detachment, well then here is another opportunity to do so. Even though the FISD is THE home to many of us I would love to be a member of all other detachments as well.

 

It is also very nice that two detachments can come together and have a productive conversation about things like this. I appreciate the MEPD guys coming over and participating. Please come back more often.

[LoveMonkey[501st]]

My question is where do we go from here? I'd like to see these CRLs done before episode 8, because I'm sure we'll get new costumes from it and I don't want these to lose steam.

[Lichtbringer]

I don´t like to be forced to have many accounts and passwords, just to feed the ego of any small splintergroups.

 

The more is under one banner (in one forum with subforums) the better.

[starsaber25[Admin]]

I don´t like to be forced to have many accounts and passwords, just to feed the ego of any small splintergroups.

 

The more is under one banner (in one forum with subforums) the better.

Michael this isn't about forcing members to have more logins and passwords for websites. This is about organizing the groups of costumes to the correct detachment for the 501st legion. Many 501st legion members already have accounts for the other detachments as we love to acquire other costumes to volunteer our time and troop in.

[Daetrin[Admin]]

My question is where do we go from here? I'd like to see these CRLs done before episode 8, because I'm sure we'll get new costumes from it and I don't want these to lose steam.

Both Tim (Dark CMF) & I had have had a bout of Darth Real Life lately, it's certainly coming in July for sure. R1 CRL will be complete as will the HWT costume segregation. Not sure if TFA re-write will be done by end of July though...