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PlayfulWolfCub

E-11 Power Cylinders Research Thread (renamed from "3 Central Fuses...")

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Ha! no you have to read my edit. My posting was altered it obviously doesn't like the word pr*** :laugh1:

Mathias - Andy I would suggest put in far more ground work than I. It was nice getting mail from him it simply helped spur you along. I heard from him today and I believe he is no longer in the search :(

Guess it's time to get in the saddle again :laugh1:

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I was asking about the dimensions of the 3 inner capacitors,

 

The dimensions I just gave are for the 3 inner capacitors. I said 9 because that's how many I've got - sorry for the confusion. Here are the dims again:

 

I understand the original TCC caps were hand made and they vary very slightly between 25.8 - 26.5mm long, 5mm wide & the end caps from 3.5 - 4mm at their widest point

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I'll admit I don't understand the point that Vern & Matthias seem to be disagreeing about regarding component E

 

LetteredCylinderparts.jpg

 

However, given that our most up-to-date research suggest that the unit was from British naval radar (or possibly, though less likely, British Air Force) component E might be from this system although the physical design in these photos isn't exactly the same:

 

Pye Co-axial Connector

 

PyeCo-axialconnectorfromBritishMilitaryRFequipment1939-69.jpg

 

An important innovation from this time was the "Pye plug" coaxial connector, conceived for the early AI and ASV radar equipments by Donald (Bo) Jackson and designed by mechanical designer George Baguley. The objective was to provide quickly detachable coaxial cables between the modules of the early airborne radar equipment and avoid the problem of poor high-frequency impedance matching (poor return loss and reflected signals) in cables which would otherwise have been terminated in a simple 'pig-tail' soldered connection.

 

The initial Pye connector was a right-angle elbow type with a range of different size co-ax cable entry clamps, but was expanded to include straight , T-piece and back-to-back connectors. The design was subsequently used in the majority of British RF equipment during the war. Illustrated above left are the Pye plug and socket and T-piece.

 

The connector design was also used by Pye Telecom commercially on all of the radio-telephone equipment from 1946 until the end of the Ranger series of mobiles and base stations in 1964.

 

Pye Connector in use from 1939 to 1969 in Military service

Source: http://www.pyetelecomhistory.org/prodhist/military/military.html

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Andy, you said there were some photos where there were mostly groups of 3 capacitors but that there was at least one group of 2 capacitors. I've looked at my photos & I can't find any where that's the case. I've got some photos where the wires for one of the capacitors has been bent, so the capacitor is out of sight but the 3rd wire is still visible.

 

You may have a photo I don't have - can you post one that shows what you mean? Cheers

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I had a great chat to Andy this morning and he pointed out the serial plates on the mouse droid & speeder. There is one legible number that can be read on quite a few photos but I haven't found one that allows any of the left hand plate to be read.

 

Does anyone have one? If we were phenominally lucky it would have the name of the manufacturer and the unit designation on it.

 

I think it'd be really useful if comeone could go take a high-res zoomed-in pic of the props at a Star Wars exhibition. Are any on anywhere in the world at the moment?

 

Can we ask around? I'm new here but you'll know who might be good to approach. I'll make a new post here & on RPF entitled "Star Wars Exhibition!" to grab people's attention. What category should I post in on FISD to get seen by the most people?

 

Serialplates.jpg

Edited by PlayfulWolfCub

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Current exhibition schedule for SW: Where Science Meets Imagination in the US:

http://www.mos.org/v...g_exhibits&p=sw

The landspeeder is part of this exhibit although it's usually behind ropes. If you want good shots of the cylinders you'll need a big zoom lens.

 

I tried to get shots last time this exhibit was near me, but I didn't have a good enough camera.

 

The MSE droid was last seen as part of Star Wars: The Exhibition (last stop was in Chile 2009).

That show is over as far as I know.

 

I tried to get a shot of that plate when I saw the exhibition in London in 2007. As far as I can tell the plate is smooth - no stamped numbers visible.

Edited by lonepigeon

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Thanks for all that, Chris :)

 

So if the MSE plate is smooth are best bet if the speeder. Do you think that a good zoom camera could capture some info from that or is this a dead end that people have tried before?

 

 

Sometime people are afraid to ask obvious questions for fear of seeming stupid. I'm the noob here so I'll ask...

 

1) Has everyone that made/used the E11s/MSE/Speeder been asked what the parts were? Can we make a check-list to be sure?

 

2) Has anyone approached George himself & asked him if he'd be perepared to do his fan-base a huge favour & let one of us study/photograph/cast from the MSE or speeder? You might have the necessary credentials, Chris, as Star Wars artist & co-founder of "The Parts of Star Wars". Would you be interested in doing this?

 

3) This is an aside really... Why do even the Lucasfilm-approved expensive replica E11s have innacurate cylinders? Has anyone ever pointed it out to them?

 

4) Do we know if anyone has done work on this subject who hasn't yet joined this thread? We're in the blasters section but MSE/speeder research would be just as valuable.

 

 

 

I've made a rough model incorporating the new capacitors. It's not pretty or accurate enough yet to post photos but it lines up well with the MSE/speeder photos. I'll tweak it with ANH screenshots & make a styrene model.. I'll show pics of that with a template and ask people to check & feedback on it if they could :)

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I believe there's only once licensed E-11 made, by Master Replicas and that one doesn't even have the cylinders.

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Well that's one way of getting round the problem! lol

 

Thanks for the correction, Matthias - I'll have to refresh my memory of the different commercial ones. I think I mentally lumped them all together as "expensive considering they're inaccurate" when I realised you can build an genuine parts E11 for way less than an MR! :)

Edited by PlayfulWolfCub

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Andy, you said there were some photos where there were mostly groups of 3 capacitors but that there was at least one group of 2 capacitors. I've looked at my photos & I can't find any where that's the case. I've got some photos where the wires for one of the capacitors has been bent, so the capacitor is out of sight but the 3rd wire is still visible.

 

You may have a photo I don't have - can you post one that shows what you mean? Cheers

Hi Andy, yes looking at them again there is thee capacitors in all the pics but it looks like the end ones are made up of a set of two long ones and one short one. these are shown in the mouse and landspeeder photos so I don't think these are just bent. Maybe the smaller ones have a different rating.

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I think I have found the K on the capacitors :) TCC also were called melalpack and picopack. I have a couple of picopack coming that look about the right size so I will see if the writing matches up

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I think I have found the K on the capacitors :) TCC also were called melalpack and picopack. I have a couple of picopack coming that look about the right size so I will see if the writing matches up

I think I have found the K on the capacitors :) TCC also were called melalpack and picopack. I have a couple of picopack coming that look about the right size so I will see if the writing matches up

:laugh1: :laugh1: I've just relised the K would be the other way around!

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Hi Andy, yes looking at them again there is thee capacitors in all the pics but it looks like the end ones are made up of a set of two long ones and one short one. these are shown in the mouse and landspeeder photos so I don't think these are just bent. Maybe the smaller ones have a different rating.

 

You're absolutely right Andy and I think I can offer a photo-supported explanation. The end caps are the same ones but they join onto lower components - see photo. If I was a proppy working on the E11 I'd have just pushed the "shorter" one back through the frame once I'd cut it off at the back to be the same length as the others - it'd be quicker than cutting them off at the front. This might explain why, on some photos, one of the capacitors is diagonal - that capacitor which was lower had more wire on the front end & they pushed it the the side. I'm more confident now that all the E11 power cylinders had 3 capacitors and individual builders can choose whether to add a diagonal or parallel top one! :)

 

capjoinslowercomponent.jpg

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:laugh1: :laugh1: I've just relised the K would be the other way around!

 

Doh! I was just about to type "Awesome find Andy!!!!!!" but I'll hold on that, eh? (Though finding the caps at all makes your awesomeness so great that it can't be measured on any known scale!) I look forward to seeing the 'packs :)

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I will chase up some of my old contacts to see if they know what the K is

 

 

Re: Capacitor codes - help needed

 

 

Quote: The use of the letter "K" (which doesn't seem to stand for 1,000 I think it's the tolerance. Commonly used letters are L,J and K. Although I can't remember which is which OTTOMH

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"Nothing is as dangerous as being too modern;one is apt to grow old fashioned quite suddenly." user_offline.gif

 

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post_old.gif 4th Oct 2008, 05:12 PM #11

M0TAW Tony

Pentode

 

 

Join Date: Feb 2007

Location: Telford

Posts: 157

 

icon1.gifRe: Capacitor codes - help needed

Hi

B = +/- 0.1%

C = +/- 0.25

D = +/- 0.5

F = +/- 1%

G = +/- 2

J = +/- 5

K = +/- 10%

M = +/- 20

Z = +80 to -20% Must be for electrolytics I guess

 

ATB

Tony

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As has been suggested before, I'd say they're "METALMITE"s with a K rating and, having done some modelling up, exactly the same dimensions as the ones I've bought off you, Andy :)

 

This is what I read on each cap. Maybe someone has a higher res version or better eyes than me and can fill in the gaps?

 

Cap 1: ……70’C & ……00’C

Cap 2: (hidden because pushed further through backplate)

Cap 3: (?)

Cap 4: 500 V……

Cap 5: “M…… & K……

Cap 6: ……LA (?)

Cap 7: (hidden)

Cap 8: (?)

Cap 9: (hidden)

Cap 10: ……ITE”

Cap 11: ……(?)

Cap 12: (hidden)

 

cdaa.jpg

Edited by PlayfulWolfCub

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Thanks for all that, Chris :)

 

So if the MSE plate is smooth are best bet if the speeder. Do you think that a good zoom camera could capture some info from that or is this a dead end that people have tried before?

 

 

Sometime people are afraid to ask obvious questions for fear of seeming stupid. I'm the noob here so I'll ask...

 

1) Has everyone that made/used the E11s/MSE/Speeder been asked what the parts were? Can we make a check-list to be sure?

 

2) Has anyone approached George himself & asked him if he'd be perepared to do his fan-base a huge favour & let one of us study/photograph/cast from the MSE or speeder? You might have the necessary credentials, Chris, as Star Wars artist & co-founder of "The Parts of Star Wars". Would you be interested in doing this?

 

3) This is an aside really... Why do even the Lucasfilm-approved expensive replica E11s have innacurate cylinders? Has anyone ever pointed it out to them?

 

4) Do we know if anyone has done work on this subject who hasn't yet joined this thread? We're in the blasters section but MSE/speeder research would be just as valuable.

 

 

 

I've made a rough model incorporating the new capacitors. It's not pretty or accurate enough yet to post photos but it lines up well with the MSE/speeder photos. I'll tweak it with ANH screenshots & make a styrene model.. I'll show pics of that with a template and ask people to check & feedback on it if they could :)

 

A nice zoom lens might work (probably what TK895 did), but it depends if you can get a shot at the right angle to see the plate (tricky on the landspeeder). Hopefully the plate is legible too. It looks like it's covered in decades of dirt/dust.

Answers to your questions

1). The blasters were made at Bapty, but they were probably just given the scrap to work with by the art department. I don't think anyone is still around to ask and they likely wouldn't remember anything that specific.

I do have one related idea to this. There might be someone to ask. I'm going to check on it.

 

2). George is too high up the food chain for a request like this. Lucasfilm's not just going to do something like this because they're asked. I do have credentials (I work full time on Star Wars) but I haven't had any opportunities to see any cylinders up close (although I have handled several original props from the archives). Of course if I have a chance to examine any original cylinders I will, but I don't foresee that happening anytime soon. The Landspeeder and the MSE droid are the only props of any use for this research. Access to the archives is VERY restricted.

 

3). Answered above. Master Replicas skipped the cylinders and Hengstler box. Maybe if EFX does a blaster there's hope.

 

4). There's an incredible MSE builder with really nice replicas, but his stuff is all scratch built based on exhibit photos.

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I'm really liking this thread~! and I was just noticing that the RCA style plug on the landspeeder photos has a shield

where the RCA would slide around the outside of the cap, while the inner part is male, and the wire plugged into it would

be a female plug.

 

if this system is a radar system then that would explain the need for a monitor out, which this could be a CCTV out

to a tube television style monitor?

 

perhaps when we get more data we'll know!

 

also on parsing the capacitors you have to look for the % sign!

 

it's on there!~

Edited by TK Bondservnt 2392

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I'm really liking this thread~! and I was just noticing that the RCA style plug on the landspeeder photos has a shield

where the RCA would slide around the outside of the cap, while the inner part is male, and the wire plugged into it would

be a female plug.

 

if this system is a radar system then that would explain the need for a monitor out, which this could be a CCTV out

to a tube television style monitor?

 

perhaps when we get more data we'll know!

 

also on parsing the capacitors you have to look for the % sign!

 

it's on there!~

It has no meaning if it's male or female (given that you connect stuff the same way all the time throughout circuit). It's only a way of making people make less mistakes connecting stuff. Also, the signal carried can be anything.

 

Not just radar info to be processed lat a later stage or audio, or video, or anything else.

Edited by Locitus

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1). The blasters were made at Bapty, but they were probably just given the scrap to work with by the art department. I don't think anyone is still around to ask and they likely wouldn't remember anything that specific.

 

I can't believe I'd forgotten this but the Curator of Firearms at the Royal Armouries told me he wanted to visit Bapty if he could just find time. He said there's a guy still there in his 70s who worked on the Star Wars props! I called myself a noob jokingly earlier but I really am for forgetting that!!!! lol I've just emailed him & asked him whether he might be able to pull a few strings in his official capacity in order to arrange a visit. It's a massive favour to ask but he's a big sci-fi fan too so you never know! :)

 

4). There's an incredible MSE builder with really nice replicas, but his stuff is all scratch built based on exhibit photos.

I'd like to see his stuff - what's his name/website?

 

I'm assuming my PM reached you but isn't possible, Chris?

Edited by PlayfulWolfCub

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